• Member Since 4th May, 2013
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On the Sliding Scale Of Cynicism Vs. Idealism, I like to think of myself as being idyllically cynical. (Patreon, Ko-Fi.)

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Book cancellation, Part 3 and last: final death · 10:26am October 11th

Dear follower base,

Turns out that when someone has a fairly dubious reputation among a community, openly posting an effective Why This Is Illegal: How To Get Them Cancelled On Lulu guide in their Comments section is a bad idea.

The one on-demand online printing service I had access to can now be considered as closed off. There is nothing else I can use.

I have had offers to help me format the stories. Some people have been writing how-to guides for me to follow, while others have been attempting trial runs: seeing if they could format anything themselves. I am grateful for those offers, and wish to apologize for having wasted everyone's time. All formatting issues are now null and void, because there is nowhere to submit a completed PDF.

I'm aware of Russian printing services. They will not be used. Not only do I not wish to deal with those copyright laws, but it loses the On Demand feature of printing. I would have to fund an entire print run in advance. Based on IndieGoGo campaigns for similar projects, this is at least several thousand dollars -- per book. Similarly, I am not going to make any attempt to find print services in any other country. Same problem.

There will be no IndieGoGo campaign. I am not that stupid or delusional.

At this time, I am expressly forbidding anyone from publishing my work.

I wanted to hold a copy of my own book. I never will.

I don't want to talk about this. I don't want to read comments about it.

This topic is now permanently closed.

Report Estee · 1,502 views ·
Comments ( 39 )


Good luck, we still love you.

It is what it is.

Still a fan.

Dammit. Sorry, Estee.

Sorry to hear about the end of the book project :applecry:

Glad to see that you haven't abandoned this site completely :pinkiehappy: I hope this means that you will continue writing

Sad to hear it, but I understand.

This wont change the fact that you are awesome (at least for me). Have a big hug.

...Well, I wasn't going to comment, since you said you didn't want to read comments about it and I interpreted that as covering this, but I suppose if I misunderstood I can chime in after all, and if I didn't, hopefully this comment will just be not read with the rest of them.

So, I'm very sorry this didn't work out for you, Estee.
The universe does sometimes seem intent on making you pay for your genius with the written word...

Thank you for all you do for us.

It's easy to make a secret account on Lulu, not tell anypony about it so they have no way to get you in trouble since they don't know the account name, and sell books by shipping them to yourself then self-shipping them to the consumer. That way you can sign the books, too.

That said: I like you. But I'm almost certain at this point that you don't want to hold your book. You want to complain about never being able to hold your book. You're getting more adaptive value out of complaining and being miserable. I don't know why you're doing this, or what the emotional issue is, but you need to deal with this in therapy before you try to complete a project like this. There is a lot of baggage here under the surface that I don't understand and I'm concerned it's a sign of a much larger problem.

I’m sorry Estee.

I know this has been a dream of yours. A dream you’ve held for a lot longer than you’ve been writing fanfics.

I know there is nothing I can say, or do. But…

I’m sorry Estee, I really am.

Oh, damn. I'm sorry.

Sends a hug your way. Once again wishes Deadpool was real so I could hire him to make some jerks life miserable who ruins things for other people.

I don't think there is anything I can say that will make a difference. The one thing I can think to do has be explicitly denied. But it is still tempting to make your wish come true anyways even if it would make me a martyr.

It is disheartening to see you give up hope Estee. All your anxieties are piling in on top of each other. Right now is certainly a difficult time for you, so I wish you the best anyways. I will maintain my hope that this project can be revisited sometime down the road with a fresh set of eyes and new opportunities.

"offers you every hug I can manage"

Sorry to hear this Estee. Perhaps one day in the future, when technology has changed or more services pop up to make these things available.

Also, here's a golf clap for everyone who suggested either trying to bypass Lulu's regular process, or indicated they would do the publishing without Estee's consent. Congratulations, you successfully screwed over a top-regarded community member. *golf clap*

Also also.... as a dude who has had mental/emotional issues, a lot of the tone of your recent comments are triggering my "alarm" bells. I dunno if you need help, but you might want to consider talking with somone? In either case, we still hope you publish more great stories.

That really really sucks that it can never ever happen ever. It's sad to me that you will never get to have what you've worked so hard to make in your hands. I really wish things could change and wiggle room could be found. But I don't want to make things any worse than they are already. I just hope this doesn't mean you're going to stop writing or take down your entire catalog of works. We love your writing. I know I'm not the only one that would check out your work in original fiction if you branched out there. Please don't hate yourself or your effort so far.

Really sorry to hear that. I would have liked to have gotten your stories in my book collection, but I know firsthand that plans almost never survive contact with life.

I will continue to read and re-read your stories, and I look forward to more.

Dude seriously, you want Etsee to get therapy to do something that is at best questionably legal? Produce a product they don't have the energy for right now, which is going to go to a small amount of people who have the ability to enjoy Etsee's content in other ways.

We're here for you, Estee.

Um... That's a message of support, not a threat. (with all that's going on, I thought I better qualify that statement)

Also note that the state of mental health care in the US is a special kind of awful. The way I like to put it is "you're right that it's a mental health issue, but the two things America is worse at than keeping guns out of the hands of crazy people are keeping people from going crazy and getting crazy people the help they need".

It’s not great, but if you persist, it can be life-changing. I know, it literally saved my life

Yes, that's exactly what I said. :derpytongue2: (Sorry, Derpy's as close to an eye-rolling ponemoji as I can get here.)

Sarcasm aside: no. I want Estee to do whatever makes them happiest. However, I want Estee to seek therapy if what makes them happiest is trying to get sympathy for not being able to do something that people are more than willing to help them to do, because I am concerned for their emotional well-being. If you read the past three blog posts here and aren't concerned for how Estee is handling things emotionally right now, you're either socially oblivious or you don't care about Estee.

There is nothing "questionably legal at best" about self-publishing fanfiction. You can legally sell your fanfiction at a pony convention and it's also legal to publish a book for your own use (which is what Estee wants most, the book for themself) if you don't sell it, so there is a legitimate, entirely legal use case for this. It's even potentially legal to just go ahead and make derivative works and sell them in general if you can afford lawyers and want to be at odds with the company. The absolute worst-case scenario is you get a C&D letter that makes you stop publicizing the sale of your books, and even that doesn't stop you from selling them to friends, it just stops you from advertising sales.

Lulu's terms of service are not laws, and they don't actually care if you publish fanfiction as long as it doesn't come to their attention in a way where they could potentially be liable if you use the product in the wrong way. Dozens of pony authors do exactly what I'm describing, including the most accomplished authors on this website.

The impassible barrier here is not external.

All fanfiction is questionably legal, though. Lulu's position seems to be one of plausible deniability; they have no way of checking to see if everything they publish violates some copyright somewhere, so while they would remove any such title that they find out about, the 'finding out' is not guaranteed unless someone snitches. It's a CYA thing; corporations generally don't actually sue over fanfics. (Hands up if you remember the dawning age of fanfics with all of the "X is owned by Y PLEASE DON'T SUE ME" disclaimers.)

That said, Estee is dead set against it at this point, so there's nothing the rest of us can do but respect that choice. But having someone to talk to privately and honestly wouldn't be a bad idea.

Would you mind 'helping' more quietly and somewhere else?

Support status unchanged.

Comment posted by Ryiah deleted October 11th


Whatever Etsee decides is whatever Etsee decides. Wrapping therapy up with production of the book was just an asshole move on Trick Question's part.

Just in case you're not aware you've been misspelling their name in every post.

*Checks Patreon donation list*
*finds Estee still on the list*
*make no changes to the list and just waits for next chapter of something to show up*

And Estee is pointing out that she has enough of a dedicated hatedom that said snitching is effectively guaranteed. Which is probably true, given that horrible people would still exist even if they didn't have 4chan to coordinate on.

If this is being an asshole, then Trick Question would be the kind of asshole I would hope to have as a friend in the real world.

A friend who both calls me out and offers a way through.


You are not Estee’s friend. Trick is not Estee’s friend. I am not Estee’s friend.

For all that Estee might be more open about her life than, say, I am about mine, that does not mean that we actually have the sort of relationship which would entitle us to act and talk like Trick is.

Behavior that might be acceptable or even commendable from a friend may be entirely unwarranted and unacceptable from a non-friend.

That’s a toxic attitude to have.

People share their lives in their blogs here.
Others share parts of their lives in response.
At times, we have each other’s back.

I guess if I’m a non-friend then I should quit Estee’s Patreon and never buy kofi again? :facehoof:

Also, behaviour like what exactly?
it seems that you are dumbing down what Trick Question wrote to the point of being insulting.
Meaning, there is a difference from “go get some therapy” (which is unacceptable) that is often said in spite, to the personal note that was actually written.

Heck, I’ve shared my ups and downs on the blog posts of others here, then said how a trained professional helped me see things and get out of certain ruts and suggested that it may also help them.

That is acceptable behaviour, and I feel it shows something genuine about the person who is offering that advice, in that they are baring their soul in order to do so. Quite an act for a “non-friend”?


If you think that friendship is required for Patreon, then yeah, I guess you should stop. I’ve never thought supporting someone on Patreon had anything to do with my personal relationship with someone, and I’m honestly surprised that you think otherwise. I’ve supported Estee on Patreon and on Kofi, but I’ve never for an instant believed that this produced some kind of relationship beyond “content creator” and “content consumer.”

Trick is offering counsel where none is wanted, and should quit while they’re behind.

I suppose that some simply do see this as a content creator and consumer deal.

Other people put their heart where their mouth is.
Cheers mate.

EDIT: Sorry, let me clarify that.

Putting my heart where my mouth is - my heart is behind my statement of support on Patreon or wherever.
As opposed to a simple Patreon sub to a YouTube content creator where there are no back and forth blog discussions of life and emotions.
Here? It gets a bit more personal than that. No, I’m not just talking about Estee, I open up to a few people here.

Yes, both forms of support exist.
No, I don’t consider every Patreon pledge that someone makes is a sign of friendship.

But for a site like FimFiction, it would be rather cold to say that support is of a non-friend basis.

Seconded. I very much appreciate 5594473 's honesty and bluntness.

Thank you for your clarification. I probably owe some on my end, as well.

First of all, I'm going to shut up after this, because it's clear that there's sort of a "cultural conflict" going on here, and I'm not in any position to really gauge which culture or cultures Estee is part of, or knows how to interpret, or however you want to put it. Also, no matter which cultures Estee might be part of, I doubt that any of them would appreciate a continued argument. In hindsight, I should have made a single comment that said what I wanted to say and then remained quiet, and I'm a little embarrassed that I didn't do that.

So, in my "culture" it's possible to have a friendship with an author, care about an author, and/or financially support an author, without the presence of one of those necessarily implying any of the others (with the exception that in most friendships, there should be some emotional investment, I suppose). This is why it's very weird to me to hear Patreon support used as evidence of friendship, but I don't know if that's because there are multiple cultures on Fimfiction and we're butting heads without realizing that we're essentially speaking two different "social languages," or even if there's just one Fimfiction Culture and I just haven't picked up this part of the social vocabulary.

Anyway, for me, saying "you need to talk to a therapist" or anything along those lines is something that (1) probably only a good friend should do and (2) probably should be said in private rather than in an open comment section, so when I see people offering advice like that, it just looks like the peanut gallery making unsolicited suggestions, while Estee's past couple of blogs really feel like they're saying, when you boil things down, "I am getting super stressed by all this stuff that the peanut gallery is saying."

But, like, part of my feeling there is rooted in the cultural lens through which I'm viewing everything, and it's obvious that this cultural lens is at least a little bit suspect. Worst case scenario, I'm entirely wrong and arguing for an incorrect position; best case scenario, I'm totally right but I'm still not going to convince anybody, because this is an issue of cultural interpretations rather than agreed-upon facts, so I'm still just feeding fires. Either way, I should be quiet on the matter.

Cheers for your thoughts.
I also tend to write things that make sense in my mind, but on a second reading I realise it may make people go wtf.

Yeah, all that has needed to be said has been said.
Enjoy the rest of your day mate :ajsmug:

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