• Member Since 8th Jan, 2012
  • offline last seen Mar 13th, 2013

TAW


Hi, I'm TAW. I write terrible erotic my little pony fan fiction about cartoon horses having sex with each other, or vaguely defined human audience-inserts, for fun. Because... uh. I have no shame?

More Blog Posts63

Dec
2nd
2012

And that's a wrap. · 6:43pm Dec 2nd, 2012

I won't actually be awake for the proper deadline, and tomorrow is very busy, so I'll make the post now.

To everyone who took part in the contest, thank you very much! I hope you all had a great time writing, and I hope everybody has a great time reading.

Unfortunately, fate has decided that this week is the week to throw absolutely everything it can onto my plate. I'll hopefully be able to throw up a quick post listing all of the entries in no particular order, but judging will take a little longer.

In unrelated news, criticism is now bad. Because that's exactly what this site needed, yet another excuse for some people to go "Well I'm [REASON], so you shouldn't criticise me". No, fuck you. Don't pull that shit. I don't care if somebody is 12. If we don't criticise people when they start, it's so very easy to get the wrong things stuck. "No child left behind" demonstrably doesn't fucking work, and the average quality level of fan fiction is bad enough without seeking to drag it down further.

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Comments ( 114 )

Nice to see there are some 'famous' people in favour of harsh criticism.

brb, waiting for shitstorm incoming

Critisism of my fanfics make me squeal in delight :3

Well at least someone supports us...

TAW, you misunderstand the intention behind the ban of that group (Train Wreckage Examinators I think was there name).

Criticism is allowed and highly encouraged.
The problem with that group was that they insulted the author of the stuff they criticised. Criticism is not "This story is bad for X reasons, you're a bad writer, stop trying". Criticism is; "This story needs improvement in regards to X because Y."

It's a fairly simple model I just set up, but it's the difference between real criticism, and the criticism that TWE gave.

Criticism is a necessary and good part of amateur writing. If our readers are unwilling to tell us when they don't like something we've written, or to articulate why they disliked it, then we will never be able to improve. :facehoof:

What doesn't kill you makes you stronger.
Critisism helps people improve. If we just tell them that its good, they'll never get better.

I agree, but there's a difference between constructive criticism and viciously tearing apart a story...

The Law of Constructive Criticism dictates that, unless the accused writer violently refuses to listen to said criticism, the critic must be as polite as possible when pointing out the story's flaws.

...Of course, this IS the internet, so who the fuck cares about that, huh?

Deadline isn't until midnight, right? I still have time to finish the last part, right?:pinkiecrazy:

Criticism is always good. But it should be constructive. You've made some wonderful suggestions in your comments TAW, but not everyone actually makes good ones. Seeing a poorly worded badly formatted rapefic for example, I saw several comments that the author should go die in a fire. That's not terribly helpful. Funny, but not helpful.

Criticism is fine and needed. But it's the douchebaggery that needs to end

565069
First of all, TWE never went too far, and the fact that you think they did shows your ignorance. The only times I saw them personally insult an "author" was when the author had already attacked them. They offered help and criticism, and they will continue to do so even without the group.

I hope you're proud of yourselves, after all, it's not every day that you get to have a group on a writing site dedicated to improving the quality of stories get wiped from the face of the Earth by a moderator who wants to baby his users.

I've said my piece, and I'll leave it at that.

"No Child Left Behind"? Oh, your using the nickname for the foul law titled "No Child Let Ahead"! I know all about that. One of the reasons I was so BORED in highschool...

Critisism is needed. Just don't act like an ass while doing it.

I half-agree. Criticism is okay for anyone at any age. However, telling a 12 year old that his/her story is "Shit and should never have gotten posted" or that he/she is "A horrible writer and a terrible waste of space" is not criticism, and should not be allowed. This is what they were trying to fight. However, some people- myself included- need to learn the difference between constructive and degrading. There are people out there that are hiding their insults under a thin veil of 'Criticism', and they need to stop because insults don't help an author get better. It makes them loose faith in the site and in bronies, and our culture is crumbling. We need all that we can. And some out there don't want to be 'famous writers' or even 'good writers'. they just want to happily shoe off their love for the show, and then some people out there tear it all to shit and tell them to fuck themselves and die because their fic is terrible and should never have existed in the first place. that isn't criticism, it's just mean. what needs to be done is these newbies need a folder run by the best authors on the site and they can give them tips and help with their stories. Problem fucking solved bitches! I'm a muthafuckin' genius!

565090
They got banned for a reason.

I don't think the admins on this site are childish enough to ban people based on nothing.

565069
Please, point out the insults in my reviews.

I'd really like to know what they are.

~ScreenedPlum, TWE's Drunk Scotsman
dashie.mylittlefacewhen.com/media/f/thumb/mlfw4597.png

565102
Stop sucking up everything you hear without knowing the other side of the story.

TWE had a system to avoid this crap, and Knighty ignored it. In doing so he has lost my respect.

The users leaving comments like "Die in a fire" weren't even official TWE reviewers, and instead of banning them individually, knighty went, "Okay, I guess I'll just delete the group."

Congratulations on pissing a bunch of people off.

565090 While I do understood the purpose of TWE, the problem is that some of them decided to act like an ass, that is what caused the downfall in my opinion. Just some bad seeds that infected the tree for it to be cut down.

TAW

565069
With respect, no, it isn't. I don't *know* what sort of reviews TWE gave, I stay out of site politics 99% of the time. I'm reading that with NO IDEA what they did. I'm reading that as new people will read it, and that blog post explicitly states that criticism is sometimes not okay. Not overly harsh criticism, not insults, just criticism. And fuck everything about that. Whether the group deserved to be deleted or not, I don't know, but that blog post should not exist.

565110
Now now, don't go and think I say EVERYONE in the group was a bunch of assholes that insulted the authors.

From what I can see by skimming through your review, you're one of those that gives actual criticism, keeping it focused solely on the story.
I may have come off as believing everyone in the group was people who insulted authors, I can safely say that I never thought so. I have talked a few with the people in the group, and one of them is currently my editor for my upcoming story, and he's a bucking nice guy,

I think it was he few bad apples that spoiled the entire lot.
The idea of a group meant solely for giving constructive criticism is a great idea, but it seems that it did attact a few bad apples as I mentioned earlier.

565126
Also, this.

100%

565122 I agree with you on that. I think knighty should of banned them individually instead.

565126
I can see your point. Just re-read the blog.

Does make it sound like "criticism is bad"... :/ which is not the case. Criticism is a good thing!

565069
Not all TWE reviewers are like that. Most of them are really helpful reviewers who took the time out of their day to help some poor sap who wrote their first story, which was bad. What you must remember is that all someone needs is to join TWE and act like an ass and everyone will automatically blame the group instead of the individual. There are two sides to every story.

565127
That's precisely why the group shouldn't have been deleted. Instead of banning the idiots, knighty has pretty much encouraged a tyrannical regime. To add onto that he created a blog post outright saying that some criticism just shouldn't be allowed.

That's the "Everybody wins" mentality, and it's poison.

Good luck on your competition!

With regards to TWE, I'm not sure if the behaviour of members was always like that, but peoples actions yesterday were beyond the pale. It wasn't criticism, it was personal insults and attacks on an obviously young writer who told them that they were in tears and begged to be left alone, but the TWE people kept pouring in with insult after insult. Very, very horrible to watch and from what I've been told, not nearly an isolated case. I'm sure most of the members were good and polite reviewers, but there was a sizable minority who used it to attack and bully.

565127
If some shitheads decide to use the TWE as a reason to bully others, ban the shitheads.

Don't delete the group which doesn't condone their actions, just because they used the group as an excuse.

The main problem I have is that Knighty never gave any warning.
He just straight up deleted us without even saying "Hey, there are some dicks in your group. Sort them out."
He didn't give us a chance to even explain what was going on, never mind sort it out ourselves.

Hell, the blogpost was the first time I actually heard Knighty had deleted us. Or this bullying thing that people keep on mentioning.

565069

TWE is Train Wreck Explorers, and the whole issue was a little more convulted than that, but you strike a grain of truth.

Like anything involving people, there were/are differing opinions and practices across every conceivable spectrum that anybody could care to approximate.

It's disheartening that the issues couldn't be resolved in a fashion other than the damning judgement and wrath of mod, but that's the way of it and gesticulating one way or another...it goes around in circles, perhaps.

There's nothing inherinantly false in your analogy, but you flanderize the issue a bit much...and it's that inherant complexity and diveristy that made everything such a mess to begin with :unsuresweetie:

565134 - it's a fine line; criticism without clarity of purpose and temperance quickly becomes abuse, yet to not criticize at all for fear of that is just as bad - if not worse - than overstepping to begin with.

It takes a pony more clever than I to make the ends meet and find the balance in all that.

I was an offciated reviewer. I just wanted to help beginners as best pick out the shortcomings of what they had, and found a group with a system in place to do so. I don't think I was ever nasty in a review - certainly never as the purpose of reviewing, but neither could I say that I've never hurt feelings in doing so.

565155 Same here. I'm only hearing about everything of the incident second hand.

TMH

*Sits back and awaits the FimFic Civil War*

There shall be blood, or at least some digi-drama.

Carry On

criticism isn't and never will be bad, and knighty never said so either, it's the executing of said criticism that matters, and that's what the whole spectacle was about. but i have to agree, knighty wasn't very smooth with the disbanding of TWE, even if i agree with the reason.

565145
Putting it like that I have only two words left to say: Point taken.

Though I don't think that deleting the group was a whole was the worst thing, but outright saying that ANY group, made with the purpose of giving criticms, made in the future, would be deleted outright.

565144
I know that, A ton of people have commented on my rather thoughtless comment (:derpytongue2:). I may have sounded like I thought it was the entire group, but I am well aware that it wasn't! My apologies if I sounded like I thought every member were the 'bad apples' as I said earlier.

565126
It doesn't say "criticism is bad", it says "some of the harsher criticism" which refers to when people were being massive dickjockeys and attacking authors and their stories with little actual helpful criticism, just a tirade of insults and demands to leave the site.

565174
No problem man. I've also had my share of thoughtless comments on the internet.

565158
I would've thought he would've at least given a warning :/
Can't really say anything else than: Keep giving the critique you previously did. You don't need a group to do it. So long as you stay true to the "rules of constructive criticism"(I think was the name), you should have no problem :twilightsmile:

565155
If you've read the meteor storm of comments I've gotten because of the initial comment I gave, you'd see that I have come to realise pretty much everything you just wrote :)

I admit that I was a bit clueless in the beginning, but a bunch of valid argumets(rare indeed... I'm used to being blindly insulted on the internet... Brony community ftw!), I've realised just what this whole thing is about, and Knighty acted way too quickly...

565177
I'm sorry, but there are no two ways about it. knighty is being a hand-holder.

By deleting TWE entirely, he is literally encouraging bad writing. Instead of banning the offenders, he has taken the liberty to destroy a group dedicated to constructive criticism.

Seriously, anyone who wanted this, I hope you're proud of yourselves. Jerks.

oh god not another TWE debate. Fine, let me get in on this

TWE wasn't criticize to improve group, they were a criticize to quit group. Because let's face it, while SOME OF THEM did good work with offering advice most of them were basically telling people to never write again. A fair amount of them were being dicks for the sake of being dicks. Hell look at what they did after the group was removed, they started upvoting every terrible fic they could find and calling them the best fics ever. The very name of the group was practically an insult. I probably wouldn't listen to them even if they DID give me good advice, whereas if a group called something like "The Writer Improvement Group." offered the same advice I'd listen... even despite the silly acronym.

I don't deny that critique is a good thing. HOWEVER I received negative comments on the first fic I posted here and I almost gave up writing here entirely, yes that fic was crap (actually it wasn't THAT bad, but it wasn't any good either) But if they had reviewed it I would have quit.

TL;DR
There's a fine line between critique and being a dick and many of their members crossed it. Having this happen the week after we get a bully awareness episode? I for one applaud our Knighty overlord

Critique is good. I've always appreciated it when people look closely enough at what I've written to find grammatical infelicities, spelling errors and copy-and-paste disasters. It's an open question whether comments threads are a suitable forum for more substantial criticism, but that doesn't stop users from trying.

Giving kids an excuse to dogpile on marginal works by authors who may not be able to learn from critique? Not so much.

Mob "moderation" by spamming comments and downvotes won't fix the problem of crappy fics.

From what I've seen, some of the people involved in the "Train Wreck Explorers" were interested in substantial critique. Many weren't. See for yourself: dig around in the Google cache while it's still around. Fun fact: lots of the deep links still work!

Then there are the issues surrounding like-minded groups with less pure motives and less internal restraint against using FIMFiction as a platform for harassment.

That said -- while comment threads are a terrible place for deeper critical discussion, it would be a shame if mod pressure prevents the use of the site's message board functions to provide authors and readers a chance to discuss issues more substantial than superficial mistakes. It's less stupid than trying to use the story comments for that purpose, and may -- possibly -- even forestall crap getting submitted in the first place.

565201
Not really. The very name "Train Wreck Explorers" doesn't scream "group that wants to help people improve". It suggests something more like "LOL LET'S GO TO SHIT STORIES".

I'm not gonna completely tear into the TWE because I did see the occasional good, helpful review/criticism from it's members on a story or two, but the vast majority of TWE comments I saw were just demands to leave the site and QUIT WRITING FOREVER etc. Maybe I just went on the wrong stories, but the majority of stuff I've seen from the TWE has been completely unreasonable, douchey-for-the-sake-of-being-douchey insult-fests.

565223
There's one simple problem with that.

All he had to do was ask them to change their name. It was that simple.

But no, the delete button was easier. It was also easier than banning any outliers that insulted people. Easier than, you know, communicating with the group to make it better.

I think the problem started with the name of the group.

If they had been 'Critics United' or something less insulting there might not have been the problem. Though I agree that the mods could have gone about it better.

565233
It's no big deal, I'm sure another group will spring up soon (in fact there's already a few for new writers I think) and if it has a less provocative name then it's less likely to attract a bunch of assholes, so there'll be no need to nuke the group again.

565177

This. Also, the group's name in and of itself served as an insult to those put in it. While I think TWE could have done with a name change and a serious wake up call instead of a deletion, there are other groups here that I think should just be deleted based on their purpose and activities. I hope knighty follows through on that front.

Also, I find the idea that any criticism is now banned to be a harsh overreaction. The continued existence of "Author Support" and "The Writer's Group" serve as examples that it is not criticism that was caused TWE's deletion and that criticism is not banned from the site. It's the "Choo Choo M***********" style insults and harassment that's not allowed. I welcome that distinction, and honestly I think more needs to be done. The site needs a clear and enforced anti-harassment policy.

565243
This I can agree with. They'll make another group, this time more heavily moderated hopefully.

It still rustles my jimmies to no end that he just wiped them off the face of the Earth though.

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