Patreon blog takeover: Dreams Of Miracle: thaumic fiction (FanOfMostEverything) · 5:04pm Apr 30th, 2021
Some of you really push your luck on these topic choices.
Can you give us an overview of thaumic fiction? Common tropes, subgenres, notable authors and/or series, how hard it tends to be in terms of what in-'verse magic can actually do, that sort of thing?
Pushing. Your. Luck.
All right. First off: I am not going to go through the entire history of the genre and ponify the names of every major figure. Suffice it to say that Compulsive Quantifier exists, he had writer's block once, and it was the worst ten minutes of his life. But beyond that?
Let's see if we can make Twilight a little happy.
Let's start by defining the genre. As science fiction often takes what we know of current theory and tries to project forward into what might one day exist, thaumic fiction does the same thing for magic. True thaumic fiction, in the hands of a professional, tries to build on extant knowledge through proposing the advancement of theory. Take an innovation which is potentially possible, apply it to the world, and see what results.
Which brings us to the side question of what a world of magic would consider to qualify as fantasy.
We're not looking at a straight reversal here, where science fiction takes over the role which fantasy would normally play. Menajeria recognizes categories of study outside of thaumatology, and so science fiction exists as its own genre. However, it's a very small one, with very few writers choosing to go that route -- and just about all of the stories share the same theme: post-apocalyptic societal collapse and, if you're lucky, rebuild. In a world of magic, going hard SF in your plot often has a baseline requirement: The Magic Goes Away. This means that in the eyes of the typical pony reader, the majority of science fiction is horror with extra math. The math doesn't exactly help.
Fantasy requires a plot element which, as far as all knowledge and theory goes, is fully impossible. Setting up a conveyance which works via multiple short-range teleports is thaumic fiction. Having the necessary spells cast by a yak turns the story into fantasy. In order to qualify as fantasy, a story must have no means by which the innovation or effect could ever actually come to pass by the method described.
Of course, in the clash between actual researchers and writers who may have only done some of the required reading, the former have a tendency to dismiss a lot of things as fantasy. Until the moment they aren't, which is what really makes the researchers mad.
We'll get to that.
As with most genres, thaumic fiction has a number of recognized subcategories.
Alien contact is one of the most popular, because it also feels like it might be the most plausible. Most of Menajeria's residents don't wonder whether they're alone in the universe. Quite a few have never thought about it, and for the ones who do -- it's very easy to come to the same conclusion as everyone else, simply through staring up at the night sky.
You see all those stars?
Someone has to be moving them.
Logically, the universe must be filled with life. So it's just a matter of asking about what would happen when some of it finally shows up.
(This doesn't entirely apply with astronomers, who have to wrestle with a second question: is every star also a Sun? If so, what's happening with the ones which aren't? And yes, that's a supernova, which makes researchers really hope that's something which only stars do and Suns don't. And then you get into the question of formation... Also, the possibility of having an entire universe full of aliens creates its own cottage industry in the conspiracy theorist magazines, most of whom assume that They are either getting outside assistance or were the first to fall under control.)
Alien contact generally requires the writer to advance transportation magic. (The sheer distance between stars has been recognized, which means the usual explanation for why nothing's shown up yet is that it doesn't know how to reach Menajeria.) After that, it's just a matter of creating your own culture: the fact that a lot of them show up as Ponies With Odd Foreheads can be put down to the fact that it's hard to imagine something truly alien, along with the occasional desire to comment on society via what isn't quite stealth.
Because it's generally accepted that there has to be a lot of alien life, stories which go beyond first contact typically wind up in what we would see as a Federation scenario: there's going to be a new species everywhere you look, and hopefully the majority of them are going to be friendly. In fact, it's rare for a thaumic fiction writer to postulate a planet which only has one intelligent species: locally, that's not how it works, so... why would it work that way somewhere else?
Planets Of Hats. Which aren't filled with alien unicorns. Why would alien unicorns wear a hat? (Especially when they're just a metaphor for zebras.)
And where you get alien life, you also get alien invasion. The hopeful assumption is meeting those who might be hard to understand at first, but a little work might see a friendship born. It's just that there's another scenario, and a planet which has been through wars and still has national clashes which threaten to boil over can see fear in the arrival of the other -- especially for those who hardly ever travel, and see a settled zone with Vanhoover's base differences as something which is just about alien already.
However, this is where you get the truly different aliens: those who share none of the pony (or other-species) values, the ones who can't understand. It's also the home of eldritch abominations: things which don't think at all, mindlessly flowing forward because if you could think, then you'd think about what you were doing and you'd stop.
Space opera would require more stories about space. (See below.) But there is a cottage industry in fending off the invaders who came here, most of which don't have any endings planned because the authors have to sell the next book. And when it comes to stories which were promised to have a definitive conclusion... it's been nearly three decades, and that fifth volume ain't comin'.
Advancement and near-future stories are common. Propose one extra idea, and then see how society changes. Teleportation is now available through a device, cheap and easy and universally accessible? Down go the borders, and we enter the future of The World My Destination. What if stretching weather control over the entire planet becomes possible? Most of those stories tilt towards utopia: it takes a non-pony writer to decide something could now go wrong on a global scale -- but since we've got the trains now, it's time for the local version of Snowpiercer.
Clockwork constructs already exist. The concept that it might be possible for one to truly think has arisen, and so has the world of I, Automaton. This means Menajeria has the base idea of robot, if not quite the vocabulary. However, this is one of the topics where actual researchers feel that writers need to have their works reclassified, because obviously true artificial intelligence is effectively impossible. Just setting up a proper series of automatic reactions stretches the limits on what most casters could do, and such systems of non-thought are still limited in what they can accomplish. Creating the ability to synergize new concepts, to imagine... no.
As computers don't really exist (although automatic-reaction shooting galleries glowing on glass screens is a novelty item of interest), you're not really going to find that kind of neural interface. Mental control of enchanted items, however? Why not? There's a little bit of what we'd consider to be cyberpunk out there -- at least as far as dystopian societies would apply, and artificial limbs with spell enhancements can be kicked in. However, big business doesn't have anywhere near the same level of real-world corporate control, which means such cultures are generally defined by corrupt governments -- and as you may have already worked out, the subgenre of thaumrust is heavily dominated by donkeys.
Time travel comes in two categories: the ones who understand how it actually works (limited duration, no changes possible) and so use it to set up stories about predestination, or the ones who kick all actual rules out the window because the understood functions just don't make for a functional adventure plot.
But some of those writers just propose that this is how things might change. It's a logical advancement. Someone has to think of the possibility first, and then enough work might see it manifested into reality. They're just dreaming of what could be...
The Thaumaturgy Review has a problem with this.
Thaumic fiction writers and researchers seldom get along.
Actual magical advancement is generally designed to be small-scale. It doesn't always work that way: it's just generally understood that if you try to leap the entire chasm at once instead of creeping across on a slowly-built bridge, you're going to find an explosion on the other side. The Equestrian Magic Society accepts innovators, because that's how things advance at all. However, the Thaumaturgy Review tends to be more along the grumbling lines of If It Was So Important, We Would Have Thought Of It. And when it comes to writers, who just propose the change as if it were already real, without having done the actual work...
There are researchers who get tired of people coming up to them while carrying copies of a book, because they know the next question is going to be 'Can you do that?': the followup is 'Why not?' There are also staid ponies who are sick of the equivalent of nosing over an answer with no process shown. You get a few very nasty fiction review columns in journals which only exist so somepony can write a thousand words on why this would never work. And of course, there's always that one person who decided to write hard thaumic fiction and, after eight hundred pages of setting up exactly why their tiny innovation is the true one, received the rejection letter mentioning the total lack of characterization, dialogue, and plot. They just want revenge.
And there's another problem. As thaumic fiction spreads (and it's been around for a long time, but the popularity is growing), it's becoming the most-cited reason for new researchers to begin their careers. They read about something once, they dreamed of it so strongly that their mark echoes that desire, and now they're going to make it real. This generation isn't doing things properly.
...if only some of them weren't succeeding.
The fact is that there are places where reality is catching up to the dreams. A change was proposed, an advancement of theory, and then it just turned out to be a matter of working for it. Which leads people to ask the researchers why they didn't think of that...
The older generation of researchers tends to dismiss the genre, bristles when somepony brings it up, and may Moon help the student who brings a book into class. The younger often cites it as their primary inspiration. Inviting noted authors to speak in a university science lecture hall is guaranteed to start a fight.
There's a little more respect for what we'd consider as hard thaumic fiction: everything based in the rules we know, with the writer clearly having done the research to set up the next small corona spike. But it isn't much, because they haven't done the work. All they did was dream. If they'd really put in an effort, then they would be the ones who made it real, now wouldn't they?
On the whole, you don't put thaumic fiction writers and researchers in the same room. Direct interactions between the groups usually devolve into That's Not How It Works, Have You Ever Tried It?, I Don't Have To Try It When It's So Obviously Stupid, You Mean Stupid Like You? And then somepony's sending for the police.
Eventually. Given that the angriest researchers also tend to be the oldest, it can take a few minutes just to stagger up to the starting line for the initial kick.
Thaumic fiction is the realm of the dreamers. Automatic-reaction screens wouldn't exist if somepony hadn't proposed them, and a newly-marked researcher decided to make that one chapter work. The rammer and its shoving barrage of tiny artificial solid field bubbles first appeared in a book six hundred years ago: after that, it was mostly a matter of finding out which material would best take the enchantment. And if somepony ever proposed the idea of radio...
But there's a gap.
There's a lot of stories about alien contact -- but the majority of them have those new species as the ones who reached out, because the subgenre of space exploration isn't completely off the ground.
Pegasi know where breathable atmosphere runs out. Attempts to ascend beyond that height haven't gone well. A number of writers have tried to figure out how life support would operate in vacuum, and some of those theories are currently being applied -- in a different medium. Mazein is in the first stage of submarine construction: something which wouldn't have been possible without a number of stories blazing the way. But it's the first stage. Air storage, pressurized compartments, and the very nasty truth is that they're learning about things like nitrogen narcosis and decompression sickness the hard way. It's going to take a lot of time and experimentation before anyone can start to seriously consider keeping a crew alive in orbit and beyond.
The few space exploration stories which exist tend to rely on slight tweaks to known magic: okay, we're going to teleport the vessel this far forward, then rest for a while and try it again. Air supply? We're bringing earth ponies, soil, and plants. Also, that's the food supply. The plants. If things get bad enough to consider the first two options, we've already lost. Water reclamation? Um... mumble-mumble-corona-mumble-oh-look-something-just-attacked!
But on the whole, the 'they'll come to us' mentality prevails, and this may be a simple cultural outgrowth: exploration is dangerous. For Equestria, the majority of residents may never venture more than a few gallops from the settled zone of their birth. Other species may be somewhat more inclined to travel, but pushing out into the wild zones in search of the new is still among the most dangerous pursuits known. There's no guarantee of anyone getting to come back. Explorers are seen as daring, bold, and quite possibly somewhat insane. Those who are good at it tend to be admired -- from a slight distance.
There is no space race on Menajeria, because the stories which helped inspire it here aren't being written in the same kind of quantity, the cultures are different, and the baseline technology plus enchantments required to quite literally get things off the ground doesn't exist. Minotaur submarines are the first step -- but it could be a long time before anyone risks another.
Only three living ponies know that at some point in the aching void of deep time, all of it had been solved. Someone found a way to survive in vacuum, possibly even somepony. Artificial intelligence was created. They don't know how. But the evidence is clear, because the evidence is still there.
There may be a space race, in time. And if there is... the Diarchy may try to interfere. Sabotage isn't out of the question. It all depends on who's going, why, and where. And even if the intent is pure...
The Diarchy has a very real reason to worry about anyone reaching orbit.
If you want to pick the topic for this kind of blog, see my Patreon page. And if you ask for the history of the world that way, I will be very annoyed.
But Starlight Glimmer advanced on Starshirl's work in many ways.
She showed it is possible to do many things he thought impossible
That spoiler is so interesting it deserves two exclamation marks!!
Maybe someone who is smarter than me will pull all the threads together and foresee what this means thirteen steps ahead =)
5509774
Starlight Glimmer is almost totally unknown in this universe. Any discoveries that she may or may not have made have certainly not propagated out to the research community at large.
Yet.
5509797
Not widely known. But known or not, they work
Isaac Asimov.
David Gerrold's The War Against the Chtorr (maybe).
Just be careful with the collision avoidance system or you'll end up eating a lot of potatoes.
Three living ponies? Celestia, Luna, and who else?
Anyhow, thanks for this. Very interesting.
Just why is it so dangerous for someone to reach orbit? Has it been mentioned in some story? Haven't read them all yet.
5509802
Read A Mark of Appeal and that should clear things up.
5509799
Almost certainly a false attribution to Asimov, as it happens. Still a good line.
Any space race that happens in this world will be much different than our own. The space race was 'won' with landing humans on the moon. Equestria has already accomplished sending a pony to the moon a millennia ago
.
It is fascinating just how deep you have tied the culture of your verse together, I doubt many other writers would understand just how different all aspects of life is down to the rather meta question of what their own stories look like.
I'm just wondering, is there a compilation of all these lore blogs somewhere? I'd love to see more things like this.
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I don't think it was ever attributed to Asimov. It was reportedly said about Asimov by Harlan Ellison. Although that also appears to be false.
sometimes it really is a shame there is no way to upvote (or otherwise easily show great approval for) blog posts. i suppose i am just left commenting to remark on the fact that the universe you so carefully weave together is wonderful to be allowed to explore
5509799
It really is surprising just how far away a few angstroms ana or kata can be. Or rather, could be, in such a layered multiverse.
5509801
First guess: Fancypants.
1.) An Automaton shall not harm a sapient or, through inaction, allow a sapient to be harmed.
2.) An Automaton shall follow orders given to it by a sapient, unless those orders conflict with the first law.
3.) An Automaton shall protect itself, unless doing so would conflict with the first or second laws.
3 A.) An Automaton shall remind sapients about keeping its mainspring wound, unless told to shut the buck up about it.
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Half the stories are about the trouble shooters from Equestrian Automatons and Mechanical Ponies going out to wind the automaton’s mainspring. The other half are about them waiting until the mainspring runs down, so they can override the stupid order it was given.
5509807
I did read that one... Wait, is it the part that both Sun and Moon are kinda aware and connected to the sisters? Why would that make going to orbit a bad idea?
5509814
I remember a story (possibly apocryphal) about Asimov meeting another SF writer at a convention, and asking "So when is your next book coming out?" The other writer, who had been suffering from a writer's block, replied "When isn't your next book coming out?"
5510219
My guess:
Cracking a system's security is, as I understand it, much easier with direct hardware access.
5509801
My guess:
Princess Mi Amora Cadenza
5510237
In one of Asimov's more autobiographical works, he recounts the tale of the time he went on holiday.
He didn't really want to go. But his wife was insistent; he needs to get out into the fresh air and sunshine and enjoy himself!
...being Asimov, he bought his typewriter with him.
So, they get to their little holiday house. And the wife insists that he go out into the Fresh Air and Sunshine and enjoy himself. Asimov being Asimov, that means that he sets up a small desk and his typewriter in a nice patch of Fresh Air and Sunshine and starts to get to work on the next book.
...and then some passer-by, well, passes by. And asks a question. "What are you doing?" He's writing a book. "On a sunny day like this?" Yes, on a sunny day like this. "Why?" Because it's what he enjoys. "But why not put the book aside and enjoy yourself?" He was enjoying himself (before he was rudely interrupted).
Asimov politely persuades the fellow to move along and go somewhere else (though the fellow looks back a couple of time, not believing that someone would want to sit and type in such glorious weather). And then, just as Asimov is getting going with the book again, the next passer-by passes by. "What are you doing?"
...apparently places that are full of Fresh Air and Sunshine are also full of passers-by who all ask the same stupid questions. That was the first time that Asimov went to stay at a holiday house.
It was also the last time that Asimov went to stay at a holiday house.
It was all solved in deep time?? BY WHOM?! Discord‘s reign really did a number on this world, huh.
I am so fascinated by this last paragraph. Your worldbuilding is always so intriguing. Echoing someone else here, would you ever consider doing a compilation of „verse lore“ so to say, as a story? It would be really nice to have all these worldbuildin deep dives as an easily accessible and book-markable format.
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I would love this too, because well I know the universe is vast and fascinating, time for me is a limited asset and I doubt I'll ever be able to catch up