On the topic of censorship.

This looks important.

https://greenwald.substack.com/p/my-resignation-from-the-intercept

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glenn_Greenwald

Comments

[Pulsar Wave]

What terrifies me is that these attempts at censorship (some successful, others less so) are not centrally dictated, not done at a command; rather, it's a wide-spread "net" of individual institutions, news outlets, social media, etc that choose to censor: really a Cancel Culture. And it's terrifying because it's much more difficult to replace a whole culture than one party (and I'm not necessarily talking about the political organization) whose interest is censorship.

[Wydril]

Damn, I feel for that guy. Founding a news outlet to not be just another arm of institutionalized liberal censorship, and then having it turn into that right out from under him. It sounds like they were planning to force him out for a while; from the article he mentioned that they continued banking off of recognition of his name while also ascribing all mistakes and failures to him:

Making all of this worse, The Intercept — while gradually excluding the co-founders from any role in its editorial mission or direction, and making one choice after the next to which I vocally objected as a betrayal of our core mission — continued publicly to trade on my name in order to raise funds for journalism it knew I did not support. It purposely allowed the perception to fester that I was the person responsible for its journalistic mistakes in order to ensure that blame for those mistakes was heaped on me rather than the editors who were consolidating control and were responsible for them.

Props to him for willing to put it all on the line for what he believes in though. I knew that homogeneous narrative-pushing was dominating journalism and mass media, anyone with one eye and one ear could tell you that, but to the point of forcing out a man for having the wrong thoughts from a news firm he founded...damn.

And none of the critiques I have voiced about The Intercept are unique to it. To the contrary: these are the raging battles over free expression and the right of dissent raging within every major cultural, political and journalistic institution. That’s the crisis that journalism, and more broadly values of liberalism, faces. Our discourse is becoming increasingly intolerant of dissenting views, and our culture is demanding more and more submission to prevailing orthodoxies imposed by self-anointed monopolists of Truth and Righteousness, backed up by armies of online enforcement mobs.

Makes you appreciate the extremely limited number of people who haven't been crushed beneath the ideological bootheel, but the only one I can really think of any more is Tucker Carlson. Then again, he has the highest-viewed show out of any MSM host or similar service, and it's even more impressive when you see what kind of evil is working against him and those like him.

[Horse-With-No-Name]

Standard corporate crony oligarchy. I think the only reasonable news outlet I've heard the Hunter Biden story from was Krystal and Sagaar's segments on The Hill... but they're corporate too so I assume they're playing some sort of game... Of course, the right wing news media is going ahead with this news, but that's because it's advantageous to them for the election. Both sides do corrupt stuff, and whenever one side uses an anecdotal case as a weapon, the other side censors it. This may look all important now, but something else will take the stage next month, and so on and so forth. The censorship is just a symptom of deeper dysfunction.

Glenn does decent work, it will be sad to see his career damaged by this. I miss Bill Moyers
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-YhDnQKIGbE

[Wild Zontars]

5388467
Remember back when Alex Jones was kicked off the entire internet simultaneously? He was the test case. Almost everybody was OK with it, so they kept going.

To this day, I'm still not sure if Alex Jones is a media genius obfuscating the fact that he's leaking important stories by sandwiching them in between loads of wrestling-style "wink wink, nudge nudge" horseshit, smearing a conspiracy-theory on top, and funding it via plausibly-deniable "totally not donations" attached to novelty merch, or if he's an absolute lunatic who only gets the occasional thing right by accident via the "broken clock" effect, and survives by selling snake oil to millions of idiots.

In either case, the simultaneous deplatforming of all of his accounts, outlets (aside from his self-hosted sites), and even the bans on sharing his content on social media wasn't about "spreading misinformation", it was about the (occasional) inconvenient stories he reports on.

[Horse-With-No-Name]

5388473
>Tucker Carlson
>Not beholden to the agenda of Fox News

HA! No. Maybe like 50 percent of the time at the absolute best.
What people don't day is often as important as what they do say. The Real News Network does excellent reporting but every conservative I show it to flips out because it says all sorts of things they just don't get exposed to on Fox news, even from Tucker.

[AndwhatIseeisme]

I'm trying to imagine what it must feel like to put what I would assume to be a massive amount of time and effort into creating a news company based on honest, unbiased journalism, only to be scapegoated and drummed out by that very company for wrong-think. I feel terrible for this guy.

And people wonder why journalism is a dying profession. It's because of shit like this, where anyone who doesn't kowtow to their editorial board and/or corporate masters is made a pariah and cast aside.

[Alaborn]

I think the first two of Robert Conquest's three laws of politics apply here.

1. Everyone is conservative about what he knows best.
2. Any organization not explicitly right-wing sooner or later becomes left-wing.
3. The simplest way to explain the behavior of any bureaucratic organization is to assume that it is controlled by a cabal of its enemies.

Greenwald is no conservative, but he does have a conservative opinion about what mission journalism should have, and people more leftist than him took it over.

[Georg]

5388487 ....because the owners and the reporters want to be invited to the *right* parties and get interviews with the *right* people, which lets you get 'in' with the people who can tell you stuff about other people, but only the *right* people who really need to have dirt dumped on them. And if you happen to dish dirt on the wrong people, suddenly the *right* people quit talking to you.

That's one thing that Fox used to do well. You could literally tune to CBS/NBC/ABC/CNN and get the same story with the same soundbites detailing the same angle on an event, while Fox would actually tell what was going on from multiple angles. Then the owner recently decided he wanted to be loved and adored by the cocktail circuit, and it slumped rapidly leftward.

5388480 The Hunter Biden laptop story has been locked down by the mainstream press, and if reported at all, the claims of "Russian disinformation" go front and center while the reporter tries to paint over the emails and photos.
5388473 Tucker must be doing fairly well in keeping centered because I keep seeing comments from the same people either screaming in rage about his biased reporting or purring in contentment as they point out the latest jewel he has produced. The internet is schizoid, or manic/depressive depending on how you look at it. All the drugs in the world won't help.

[Horse-With-No-Name]

5388509
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WAVp57zf5to
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H_1ZP36oUiQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zUKJRUxNq9U
https://www.breitbart.com/clips/2020/10/28/limbaugh-fbi-held-hunter-biden-laptop-for-leverage-joe-biden/
Fox news and all the other right wing outlets are still mainstream news. They cover the Hunter Biden laptop situation frequently.

If you want to understand what REAL censorship is;
Note how NEITHER side of the political spectrum ever mentions the genocide in East Timor, just so the US could put a military base there
See how they covered up Jack Sarfatti's work with Hal Puthoff's work and TTSA

It's not censorship if one side of the political spectrum keeps talking about it; it's propaganda.

[Wydril]

5388486

>Tucker Carlson
>Not beholden to the agenda of Fox News

HA! No. Maybe like 50 percent of the time at the absolute best.

Slow your roll there, wild guy. First, this isn't 4chan. Second, even though your estimation is unfounded and questionably accurate, Tucker is the only one who routinely covers things that no one else will. Considering that Tucker's career has seen him go through multiple MSM outlets, predominantly left-leaning ones, while maintaining integrity and honesty, you're gonna have to do a little better than scoffing to discredit him.

By the same token, is there anyone at all on the other MSM outlets that comes close to your "50% at the absolute best" qualification?
5388509
He makes a point to report on negative actions and aspects of President Trump and his administration as well as positive ones, and he's the only one I can think of who also invites people onto the show who are ideologically opposite of himself and of Fox in general. He's probably the least-right personality of the people on Fox, with the notable exception of the deliberate punching-boy Juan Williams, but because he isn't spouting liberal narrative points the left hate him as rabidly as anyone else.

[marcelojj]

5388473
He reaped what he sowed. While in Brazil, he himself was a disseminator of discourse of intolerance against what we call "Operation Car Wash", a rare attempt by our judicial system to punish widespread corruption in our country.

[SweetBanana]

5388484

Remember back when Alex Jones was kicked off the entire internet simultaneously? He was the test case. Almost everybody was OK with it, so they kept going.

To this day, I'm still not sure if Alex Jones is a media genius obfuscating the fact that he's leaking important stories by sandwiching them in between loads of wrestling-style "wink wink, nudge nudge" horseshit, smearing a conspiracy-theory on top, and funding it via plausibly-deniable "totally not donations" attached to novelty merch, or if he's an absolute lunatic who only gets the occasional thing right by accident via the "broken clock" effect, and survives by selling snake oil to millions of idiots.

He's another facist conspiracy nut. He was all against the police when Obama was in office. So when people finally get tired of the police and corrupt right wingers, he's suddenly all for those police. Gotta keep those scary brown people and turban wearers out. Nevermind the numerous bouts of terrorism conducted by christian folk, historical or otherwise.

not that the democratic party is better, but they have a future unlike the republican party. The republican party only has one future. As pretty much only white males and rural white females vote for them. Terrorizing minorities and rigging the system against everyone who isn't a straight, white and 'god'-fearing white male, or a white woman, which to alot of right wingers is a donestic service and egg donation unit.

If your candidate is so shitty and unpopular as a whole, that a SENILE OLD MAN AND A CROOKED COP WINE AUNT DA is more attractive to the masses. Maybe you've fucked up. I was on the Trump train 4 years ago, and after getting left alone on a cold runway. I've left the bloviating billionaire and his 70's bathroom color skin.

[Nathan Hale]

5388467

not centrally dictated, not done at a command; rather, it's a wide-spread "net" of individual institutions, news outlets, social media, etc that choose to censor

This is usually referred to as a 'standalone complex' or 'accidental collectivism'; wherein detached individuals create a seemingly concentrated effort lacking a definitive or a disparate number of origins.

Just an FYI!

[Wydril]

5388571

The republican party only has one future. As pretty much only white males and rural white females vote for them.

This is so unapologetically ignorant and racist that it hurts, shame on you. Did you actually believe this?
https://www.fitsnews.com/2020/06/03/wait-donald-trumps-poll-numbers-with-minorities-are-up/
https://www.deseret.com/opinion/2020/6/15/21287201/letter-trump-has-helped-minorities-more-than-any-other-president-in-some-time
https://www.breitbart.com/2020-election/2020/09/01/polls-support-for-president-trump-surges-in-black-community/
https://www.worldtribune.com/trump-hits-all-time-high-in-poll-minority-support-surges/
https://nypost.com/2020/02/29/why-these-black-new-yorkers-are-voting-for-trump-in-2020/
https://www.bizpacreview.com/2020/09/04/president-trump-poll-numbers-gain-steam-with-minorities-amid-black-lives-matter-turmoil-968013
https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2020/07/huge-black-minority-voter-approval-president-trump-record-highs/
Read.

I was on the Trump train 4 years ago, and after getting left alone on a cold runway. I've left the bloviating billionaire and his 70's bathroom color skin.

Good, racists not wanted.

[SweetBanana]

5388598
You didn't trust polls in 2016, but now you trust them? Give me a break.

Also, you have Breitbart up there. Fucking Breitbart, I ain't takin your fake news websites seriously.

[Wydril]

5388600
I can't help but notice you totally avoided dealing with the fact that you got completely blown the fuck out and were wholly incapable of even responding to anything in the post or what it said. Shame on you, racist.
i.postimg.cc/RhvYZGyD/1235187126161.gif

[SweetBanana]

5388604
"Heh. I'll call him racist, that'll show him"

You even posted a smug anime girl. Please go back to 4chan.

[Wydril]

5388607

"Heh. I'll call him racist, that'll show him"

Well, when you make a post that's very racist and you can't stop going on about people because of their skin color, yes, that's considered racist. That's you. You are a racist. I'm not trying to "show him", I'm letting you know that you are utter filth and willfully ignorant, and that the second someone challenged your preconceptions about how people act because of their skin color, you refused to even look and jammed your head in the sand. Pathetic.

[SweetBanana]

5388608
I didn't know saying Trump had a shitty spray-on-tan is racist you pig-headed idiot. Motherfucker, I'm talking about a shithead who has condoned scraping-out Mexican women's wombs and locking children away at the border. Fucked over the working class, and 'drained the swamp' by pumping it full of water in the form of corporate stimulus bailouts while fucking over millions of Americans. Racism isn't hating flagrant racists who point out their trophy supporters. Like they're some sort of pet to keep around.

"look at my African American voter over there."

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CaPgDQkmqqM&t=200s

Please go crawl in the ditch that all you cryptofacists desperately want to drive society into. Fuck you. You shitheads insulted Steel Resolve over his dying wife. You don't deserve civil treatment, you need to be chased out like the invasive rats you are. Except, that's insulting to rats. Rats are just trying to make a living, and are pretty smart and cute animals. You're community parasites, you're idealogical flukes that worm themselves into your host community's kidneys and drain them of vim and vigor until they're a rotting corpse with the smell of 4chan.

There's no arguing with you. You never mean to change your positions. You're just here to 'own the libs'. You don't have any reasonable policies because you never reasoned yourselves into your political beliefs.

[Wydril]

5388609
Nice angry post, whataboutism doesn't change that you're still a racist.

SweetBanana's post pre-edit: i.postimg.cc/LsXTQKy3/titty018b.png
SweetBanana's post post-edit: i.postimg.cc/fbG9c61L/titty018b-edit.png

[SweetBanana]

5388610
Whatever. Now get off before your corporate overlords realize that you're shilling for them during your company-mandated "Rest and Relaxation Time"^tm. They need you in tip-top shape before you go to work again, shit in a diaper, catch covid and die for the DOW.

[Wydril]

5388611

Whatever. Now get off before your corporate overlords realize that you're shilling for them during your company-mandated "Rest and Relaxation Time"^tm. They need you in tip-top shape before you go to work again, shit in a diaper, catch covid and die for the DOW.

i.postimg.cc/X7P7B9RN/1357708629381.png

[shinybob606]

That's the thing about media, there's not really any unbiased ones, if its left wing it will censor/attack the right and if its right wing it will censor/attack the left. Like the Hunter Biden emails seem like blatant bullshit to smear but at the same time just stopping people from talking about them is kinda dumb, like just have it labeled as an opinion piece. Both sides are so unbelievable that this particular instance does just seem like a fake news smear but at the same time could be true, but i guess that is what politics is, just attack the other party so people hate them more, actual facts don't matter if the results are what you want. Republicans seem to like to attack with fake news and lies and Democrats whilst censoring obvious bullshit also like to censor opinions...

[shinybob606]

5388598
Personally i wouldn't trust Breitbart or The Gateway Pundit, those two are extreme right bias and love to post conspiracies with no sourcing, the rest you listed whilst right wing (not saying extreme) are at least somewhat reliable with sourcing and actual real information

[Wydril]

5388627
Honestly, I just Googled it, checked each link to see if the article actually said what the title suggested and supported it, and then pasted it. The only consideration I paid to the actual site was that I didn't post two links from the same one. I could have posted a hundred, but seven seemed suitable for showing that this isn't a new trend or hidden knowledge.

[Cryosite]

5388611
Man, you're such a Karen.

5388629
Lefties get really triggered by Breitbart. It's like they want to cancel it.

[shinybob606]

5388629
Fair enough, its a shame cause there's so many fucking media outlets its hard to know which to believe

[Baineblade]

5388636
Well if it's legacy (CNN, ABC, NBC, FOX) you can safely bet that throwing it in the garbage wouldn't be any appreciable loss.

[Pulsar Wave]

5388609

Please go crawl in the ditch that all you cryptofacists desperately want to drive society into.

To this I can only say:

"Heh. I'll call 'em a cryptofascist, that'll show them!"

Kudos to Wydril for not taking the bait.

[Horse-With-No-Name]

5388530
Yes: Krystal and Sagaar on The Hill, and The Real News Network. Also America Uncensored.
And I'm sure the censorship is coming their way soon

The problem with getting it right only 50% of the time is it brings people's guard down so they aren't as skeptical when they throw in the propaganda that Fox News wants to indoctrinate people with

I'm amazed how much more conservative the internet has appeared to get over the past few years, but I'm pretty sure it's the same as when the liberals had Obama for 8 years and got overconfident and shameless about expressing their views: feels good to those with conservative views to be on top, doesn't it? Feels like the things you're saying are true and right? But might doesn't make right, it just makes conflict. But then at some point they'll lose for a while and a liberal president will be on top and they'll be afraid to share their views in public again, just like the liberals are now.

and THAT is the problem: each side lording over the other and using its power to subjugate the other whenever it gets to the top of the dogpile. That will slowly tear our society apart.

And the scary thing is I don't care if it falls apart any more; and I worry many others feel the same.

Go ahead proud boys, make my day. But if you dare to subjugate minorities your days are numbered.

[Pulsar Wave]

5388699
I don't see liberals being afraid to share their views in public. Like, at all.

[Horse-With-No-Name]

5388627
Isn't it interesting how their reporting lines up with RT also? Amusing at least.

Another interesting thing to note is that Gaia TV, home of Cosmic Disclosure and one of the first outlets to mention Qanon, was sold from a bunch of wealthy Russian bankers to a bunch of wealthy NYC bankers who happen to be Trump's friends shortly after he won the election, along with many other outlets spreading Qanon content. Trump defunded Muckety and the Influence Mapping project to try and cover his tracks in that regard, but all the data the influence mapping project collected should still be in Gaia TVs SEC filings.

SEC filings have a legal responsibility not to lie, though they may bend the truth to some extent. it makes them one of the few remaining sources of real data to help you ground what's true/false and what's propaganda.

5388525
Also by the way people who downvoted, propaganda can still be true or partly true. don't conflate the propaganda status of something with its truth status. The best propaganda is built around a seed of truth.

For example, yes there is human trafficking, but it's not going on in pizza shops, it's going on in international waters. If the politicians really wanted to end human trafficking you think they'd bring that up. But they're ALL in on it, conservative or liberal. You won't solve the problem by voting for trump. You'll solve it by getting rid of the politicians alltogether, then getting a presence in international waters to actually fight the trafficking syndicates. But politics isn't about providing real solutions to real problems, its about making you fight amongst yourselves so that the elites can further divide and conquer you, cementing their control.

Another example: Yes there are illegal immigrants, but the way we have torn apart the immigration system actually makes MORE of them, and then they get used as a scapegoat
Did your company screw up some paperwork even though your're a highly skilled MIT graduate? Oops now you're an illegal immigrant
Did you plan on getting citizenship through marriage once your work visa expired? Oops that doesn't exist anymore but you're still here so you're an illegal immigrant now.
Were you promised citizenship through the DAKA program only to have it suddenly terminated? Now you're suddenly an illegal immigrant.
When you change rules in a system that takes years to process new people, it upends the plans of a huge number of people. Then what do they do? Just leave after they started a mortgage and a job here? They worked hard for that!
And what's more, the corporate establishment WANTS illegal immigrants so that it can pay them lower wages and avoid taxes in the black market, so they actively push for this because it gives them further leverage over their workers. Usually if something becomes illegal, people who did that thing before the change in the law are grandfathered in. Why isn't that the case here? HMM I wonder? HMM indeed.

If we really wanted to solve the illegal immigration problem we would make immigration quick and simple. IT CAN STILL BE SELECTIVE IF YOU PREFER, but don't just leave people hanging for 15 years and then change up the rules every few years. But the politicians will never do that because the corporate oligarchy wants their slave labor.

[Song]

So . . . not gonna take sides here, first off. In fact, that's basically my entire comment. Both sides are kind of . . . not good. Seems to be the nature of politics, really.

I am of the opinion that the more you commit to sides on something, the less progress is likely to be made. People tend to make things about which side is right, until eventually, it's all (or at least mostly) about which side you're on. It's a dangerous thing, really. I believe both sides we have currently are guilty of censorship and poor choices. And that's why I'm "apolitical", really. I'm more or less on the sidelines, watching the "political compass" roll itself closer and closer to an open incinerator. I'll watch people be stupid from a distance and laugh as things crash and burn.

However, thank you, TS, for another interesting and genuinely informative post.

[Horse-With-No-Name]

5388707
The loud "liberal" SJW types are just socially liberal and mostly parrot what they were indoctrinated with in gender studies, which was developed by corporate think tanks anyways to keep them all thinking about issues equivalent to putting a bandaid on a papercut when the country's carotid is slit because they don't want real structural change. CMV

I'm talking about actual liberals who want structural progress, like Snowden who is in exile, and Noam Chomsky who lost his position at MIT even though he had tenure, and Eric Weinstein who gets attacked from all sides now and can't get his academic papers published anymore because he alienated himself by speaking truth to power.

I'm talking about people who are deeply troubled by the fact that the politicians, both left and right say "we have to find a way to pay for health care" instead of "why is health care so expensive?". I'm talking about people who want to make health research like a public utility, because the point of a utility is to exist so we have less stuff to worry about on a daily basis and can be more productive and lead happier lives, and because the incentive would be to produce cheap cures instead of expensive treatments. Because they believe that holding people hostage for their lives is morally wrong even though it's capitalist. You don't hear opinions like that because as soon as you say "socializing medicine" a bunch of fascist/corporate thugs knock on your door (not literally... yet... unless your social platform gets big enough and you suddenly dissapear)

Also people who are happy Elon didn't get to "coup whoever we want" in Bolivia because that's morally wrong, even though advantageous to the US.

[Pulsar Wave]

5388735
Ah, it makes more sense that way. Thank you.

[Wydril]

5388699

I'm amazed how much more conservative the internet has appeared to get over the past few years, but I'm pretty sure it's the same as when the liberals had Obama for 8 years and got overconfident and shameless about expressing their views: feels good to those with conservative views to be on top, doesn't it? Feels like the things you're saying are true and right? But might doesn't make right, it just makes conflict. But then at some point they'll lose for a while and a liberal president will be on top and they'll be afraid to share their views in public again, just like the liberals are now.

and THAT is the problem: each side lording over the other and using its power to subjugate the other whenever it gets to the top of the dogpile. That will slowly tear our society apart.

I am not seeing this happen at all, actually. Liberals have become more aggressive and demanding than ever, just look at this thread; SweetBanana went full batshit-insane, but have you seen anyone with "conservative views" doing the same as him? It sure doesn't look like conservative views are on top, and the tone of society is very much "If you don't agree with every single claim we make, we will parade your life in front of people and destroy you." Reality doesn't reflect your view on it here: the equivalent would have been actual out-in-the-open capital-n Nazis parading in the streets under the previous administration and being completely untouchable in the eyes of those with social power, the way communists and socialists are doing now. But that didn't happen.

Go ahead proud boys, make my day. But if you dare to subjugate minorities your days are numbered.

Yeah, this statement makes you seem out of touch with this. There aren't mobs of right-wing rioters destroying cities for several months, but there are mobs of left-wing rioters doing it. You're railing against a boogeyman group trying to "subjugate minorities" while liberal control of the media, school system, corporate HR and marketing, and technology companies has already subjugated everyone.

[Horse-With-No-Name]

I am not seeing this happen at all, actually. Liberals have become more aggressive and demanding than ever, just look at this thread; SweetBanana went full batshit-insane, but have you seen anyone with "conservative views" doing the same as him?

Yes, back during Obama's presidency when the right basically seemed to go insane spouting BS like Obama's a Kenyan manchurian candidate!, and Alex Jones' quintessential gay frogs rant. Now the sjw liberals feel like they're on the ropes and they're fighting back however they can, with or without logic to it. Same old game.
An eye for an eye makes the whole world go blind. If we want society to continue we need to do better.

Yeah, this statement makes you seem out of touch with this. There aren't mobs of right-wing rioters destroying cities for several months

Who do you think are stockpiling 3D printed guns and AR15s right now? Not the liberals. Also the FBI and various other organizations pay people to instigate violence and undermine the legitimacy of the protest, and set up would be political leaders with planted evidence (all the modern MLK Jrs are already in jail ahead of time) and then astroturfing companies come in like mold on bread to manipulate the grassroots movements whatever way they want. Any protest that starts without a plan in the modern day, inevitably becomes part of someone else's plan. Same thing happened to Occupy Wall Street after the 2008 housing bubble burst, and same thing happened to the Tea Party movement too, though they had more intact leadership because it's a conservative movement and the FBI has a conservative bias. Same deal with cancel culture: it's the Death Star of the corporate establishment. All the reasonable people, Like Glenn Greenwald where this discussion started, want basically nothing to do with it whether liberal or conservative.

That said, yeah, the proud boys are less violent than the boogaloo boys I guess but there's decent overlap. They're just keeping quiet for now though, and the FBI feels no need to undermine them because it's right wing too. And anyways I don't see their takeover as necessarily a net negative if they remove the corporate oligarchy, but I won't stand for it if it turns out they intend to replace it with something worse or get co-opted by other astroturfing companies and just perpetuate more corporate oligarchy. Sadly, the odds aren't looking good. We will see.

[SweetBanana]

5388744

I am not seeing this happen at all, actually. Liberals have become more aggressive and demanding than ever, just look at this thread; SweetBanana went full batshit-insane, but have you seen anyone with "conservative views" doing the same as him? It sure doesn't look like conservative views are on top, and the tone of society is very much "If you don't agree with every single claim we make, we will parade your life in front of people and destroy you." Reality doesn't reflect your view on it here: the equivalent would have been actual out-in-the-open capital-n Nazis parading in the streets under the previous administration and being completely untouchable in the eyes of those with social power, the way communists and socialists are doing now. But that didn't happen.

If most conservatives let the mask slip, they'd get chased out. Considering that the modern party was founded by Barry Goldwater appealing to segregationists, and then trying to remove all social programs and appeal to a cycle of 30 years nostalgia. Nevermind that Conservatism believes in a social hierarchy, wants to get rid of minimum wages and fuck over the working class even more because 'we're just the working class, our overlords in the wealthy know how to rule us better'. The democrats aren't better, but given how popular Bernie was. There's hope for the party in the future, once the dinosaurs finally crumble away.

Yeah, this statement makes you seem out of touch with this. There aren't mobs of right-wing rioters destroying cities for several months, but there are mobs of left-wing rioters doing it. You're railing against a boogeyman group trying to "subjugate minorities" while liberal control of the media, school system, corporate HR and marketing, and technology companies has already subjugated everyone.

No. Instead there are police who escalate peaceful protests into riots, and then there's unmarked secret federal police abducting people off the street. Right Wing rioters dont exist because most of them are fundamentally bootlickers. Nevermind Ruby Ridge, and other shit. The police aren't anyones friend. They'd glad stomp on the throats of every 'blue-lives matter' mouthbreather if their bosses told them to. That's why people are rioting. They're getting tired of a group that are legally protected and abuse power at every turn. They've dropped bombs on neighborhoods, shor kids for being autistic, and murdered people because they dared to smoke a blunt.

The rioting will continue. Until morale improves.

[Horse-With-No-Name]

5388791
You might enjoy this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RKgyOOU8moc

[Horse-With-No-Name]

5388744

You're railing against a boogeyman group trying to "subjugate minorities" while liberal control of the media, school system, corporate HR and marketing, and technology companies has already subjugated everyone.

You misunderstand: yes the corporate oligarchy is sucking the life out if this country, but it does that by dividing and conquering, provoking the two sides into doing things the other side increasingly finds disgusting or even unforgivable.

I'm saying if the proud boys fall for their astroturfing BS, I'm giving up on fixing the system and focusing instead on easing human suffering whether or not each tribe even acknowledges that suffering. That may include protecting people from the proud boys, or from antifa. Doesn't matter anymore because at that point we are screwed as a country.

[Horse-With-No-Name]

5388782
Looks like we've got some proud boys around here based on the downvotes...
'I'm sure some are good people' :P

Really most of their media is fine but if you dig deeper on their facebook/social media groups, discord chats, etc. you see people training and distributing guns. I wouldn't make any such claims if I didn't do digging with firsthand sources. I've met people in person who say they will attempt to start a civil war if Trump loses. Make sure they don't. The proper way to go about this is with a constitutional convention, ideally via referendum. But I have heard no serious talk of plans for that.

[Pulsar Wave]

5388904

I've met people in person who say they will attempt to start a civil war if Trump loses. Let's hope they don't.

Indeed. And let's hope others won't do the same if Trump wins.

[Horse-With-No-Name]

5388907
Indeed; two sides of the same coin. Thanks; sometimes my biases get the better of me too; I'm only human

[Horse-With-No-Name]

5388467
Oh and you're totally right: the fact that basically all parts of this are a distributed system makes it especially difficult to control.

I spoke to some guys about it high up at Google: the problem is the left and the right trigger each other's fight or flight response, which maximizes online/social media engagement. So the system runs away and grows exponentially. No one I spoke to at Google had any idea how to solve this. Check out The Social Dilemma on Netflix if you haven't already: might be more harrowing than Black Mirror, especially because this time it's true.

[Horse-With-No-Name]

5388707
Oh also the last time we had this much economic inequality was in the 1920s and in response to that we had vibrant socialist and communist movements which saved us after the great depression. Without the public works programs in the 30's and the military production in the 40's (all technically socialist programs due to a high degree of central planning) America might not exist in its current form today. Without the socialist and communist movements there would never have been enough pressure to implement public works programs, or Glass Steagall for that matter.

Today though, where is the equivalent modern response? Buried. Truly censored. Like 'thrown in a river with lead weights tied to you' censored. Conservatives be glad you're not actually censored.

[Horse-With-No-Name]

I have to believe it's still possible for us all to walk away from what's coming. Here's three examples of what that might look like.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I6w5AN_Wcak

Somehow it still all boils down to friendship.

[Pulsar Wave]

5388926
No need to apologize, I wasn't trying to hold your "bias" against you; merely supplemented your otherwise fair statement.
5388931
Yes, engagement wouldn't be a problem if some people and platforms didn't want to remove "problematic", "dangerous" or "politically incorrect" opinions. Though if I can be honest with you, if high ups at Google have no clue how to solve this, then we're mighty far from the end of the tunnel, and it's not reassuring in the slightest.

[Wydril]

5389013

Yes, engagement wouldn't be a problem if some people and platforms didn't want to remove "problematic", "dangerous" or "politically incorrect" opinions. Though if I can be honest with you, if high ups at Google have no clue how to solve this, then we're mighty far from the end of the tunnel, and it's not reassuring in the slightest.

That's the largest threat to democracy and our way of life today. The founding fathers intended everyone to be able to speak their minds without fear of having their lives destroyed or taken, but at the time couldn't imagine a future where corporations have so much power and control over the average citizen. The pocket-dictators who gleefully shout "It's not censorship because it's not the government!" as people are silenced are exactly who the founding fathers wanted to prevent from having the power to do so. Enabling the rule of fear from the power of the mob is the least-American thing someone can do.

I wouldn't turn to the higher-ups at Google, as they simply view themselves as unelected rulers as evidenced by their continued actions to filter and control what things people are "allowed" to see and think and say. That very thing is what prompted the colonies to break away from England in the first place; a distant and uncaring king handing down decrees and punishments without the citizenry having a say in the matter. Does anyone believe that tech-giant executives are beholden to a single entity besides themselves?
5388611
What goes around comes around.

[Horse-With-No-Name]

5388791
1: They don't get chased out. Cancel culture just makes them a martyr in conservative news media and gets used to further delegitimize the left in their eyes. They usually still have a platform on the right, but you don't see them anymore and so have no way to respond to their rhetoric. It just traps all the people you'd really need to convince in a separate filter bubble from you. Continuing to pretend they don't still get to exist after they've done something bad is like trying to hide from a murderer under a blanket. Feels comfortable till you get stabbed.
2:The dinosaurs will not crumble away of their own accord, The military industrial complex/deep state/global corporate oligarchy is the most powerful organization in human history and it will use all the tools at its disposal to stay that way. If we all opt out of the economy using "technocopias" as I described in TS's previous blog post, we might have a chance by starving the economies that support them. Or they will find a reason to outlaw that technology.
3: the police are your friend, they just have shitty training. In northern europe where government more or less functions, police go through 4 years of rigorous training like a college degree here. In the US they get 7 weeks and someone hands them a gun. The right to bear arms used to apply to well organized and trained militias. Decidedly not drunk wifebeaters. Not to imply that cops are that, just trying to drive home how important the training is.

I like your gumption, but you must recognize you're playing into their hands, becoming part of the ouroboros.

[Horse-With-No-Name]

5388904
More downvotes. Fine I'll cite some sources. I don't want to link to the social media though: don't want to risk getting kicked off those since this sort of thing is really important to keep tabs on.

And to be fair Antifa stockpiles weapons too:
https://www.huffpost.com/entry/portland-oregon-cops-knew-fascists-had-weapons-cache_n_5bc5e853e4b0d38b5871be1b
So yeah let's hope neither side instigates civil war

https://www.foxnews.com/us/portland-protests-proud-boy-arrested-gun-antifa
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/oct/01/proud-boys-white-supremacist-group-law-enforcement-agencies
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boogaloo_movement
https://www.reddit.com/r/Gilroy/comments/ihttps://www.rawstory.com/2020/06/colorado-cops-seize-weapons-and-military-gear-from-boogaloo-bois-after-george-floyd-protest/kd1ug/gilroy_boogaloo_boy_arrested_with_a_stockpile_of/
https://www.jta.org/2020/06/05/united-states/meet-the-boogaloo-bois-the-violent-right-wing-extremists-who-mostly-dont-hate-the-jews
(oh looks like the FBI has taken some actions against the boogaloo; my bad. Good to know.)
https://www.voanews.com/usa/race-america/boogaloo-boys-aim-provoke-2nd-us-civil-war
https://www.forbes.com/sites/jemimamcevoy/2020/09/30/proud-boy-arrested-on-six-felony-charges-in-portland/?sh=6a2675bd6e2f
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8745441/Heavily-armed-protesters-wearing-Proud-Boys-Black-Guns-Matter-masks-enter-Michigan-Capitol.html
https://www.newsweek.com/proud-boys-trump-civil-war-qanon-1538208

https://podknife.com/episodes/proud-boys-the-boogaloo-and-everything-in-between
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/jul/08/boogaloo-boys-movement-who-are-they-what-do-they-believe
https://www.msn.com/en-xl/news/other/who-are-boogaloo-bois-antifa-and-proud-boys/ar-BB15CFGR
https://reason.com/video/2020/10/16/the-complicated-truth-about-the-boogaloo-movement/
And to be fair, the Boogaloo movement I saw started as standard libertarian fare, but was then hijacked by corporate astroturfing and polluted by white supremacist nonsense that wasn't part of the original thing. So to the people around the movement from the start I'll just warn: your movement has been hijacked by third party interests and maybe if you can clean house and direct focus to some clear and well thought out goals you can get back on track. I'd say the exact same to Antifa. Both movements are being lead on. "proud boys" was a decent attempt at rebranding but you're not out of the woods yet. If I'm in there you can bet there's other people watching, and worse; manipulating your movement.

I'm just holding up a mirror and it's been getting a lot of downvotes. If you don't like what you see, then change.

Or don't. You can lead a horse to water but you can't make it think. I don't care anymore except I'd rather you live, and I trained with marines and worked on ITAR projects so you won't get far if you have to go up against me, a real patriot.