Equestria vs Mordor? · 7:45am Sep 26th, 2020
Would Equestria be able to aid against Mordor at its strongest? Second Age Mordor. Sauron has the One Ring in this scenario and is a coward and hides in his fortress of Barad-dûr, and just uses his near-endless legions of orcs and other monsters most of the time. He will only fight in the field if he has no other choice. Let's say in this scenario Mordor has more or less destroyed Gondor. Mordor won the Battle of Dagorlad. Sauron lost many orcs, but his legions are quickly recovering. Osgiliath and Minas Tirth are burning, most of their inhabitants are either killed or enslaved. Masses of refugees and what remains of the Last Alliance's armies are fleeing westward to escape, only parts of western Gondor are still alive. Isildur is still alive, and trying to flee west, but is being chased.
Equestria appears in far west Gondor, connected by a single land bridge, several miles across. What should Equestria do? They may only have about two weeks before Mordor's vast host of doom will come knocking on their door. Should they go on the offensive? Or be defensive? Should they allow Gondor refugees and the remaining armies of the Last Alliance to flee into Equestria? Should they try to save Isildur, the only surviving member of the High King of Gondor and Arnor? In this, case, just Arnor for the most part. Would Equestria be able to rally what remains of the resistance against Sauron? Their morale would be extremely low since the Kindom of Gondor has fallen, leaving most of Middle Earth wide open to be attacked by Sauron.
i have no clue but just yes on this fight
I think that Equestria after coronation of Twilight as ruler of it could defeat the Mordor.(With big losses) I think that Equestria before Twilight coronation will just be stuck in stalemate.
Fuck no.
If we're talking about the second age, Equestria and Middle-Earth are on entirely different power levels; and with the one ring, Sauron is basically a demigod. It was entirely a fluke that Isildur managed to stop him.
The opening scene in PJ's Fellowship depicts Sauron casually flinging entire armies around with one hand. That wasn't a Hollywood exaggeration. If anything, it was a major understatement of what a fully-powered Sauron could do.
5364422
but if we include the ring, we should also include the Elements. and the Elements are way more powerful (if they feel like it)
astral Twilight is an ancient, highly advanced ai, that can predict the future, and track the Locations of every character and item in existence, marauder map style and can reverse engenier any magic it ever Encounters, like how it assimilated the mean six, to get a face, copied the bloodstone scepters Dragon summoning magic (and modiied it to work on any species for the creation of the map), or how it copied lunas unique magic to create a shared Dream between the Student six, across the entire world map, while Luna was only shown to be able to do that across a single town. so it could just create an infinite number of copies of the one ring, for equestrias armies. It can duplicate cozy glows magic circle to turn off all the magic in middle earth, while being immune to magic draining abilities itself. also on a side note, it has a rainbow laser, thats capable of destroying the one ring, without having to go to death mountain for three books, as its attacks Bypass any magic immunities its target may have.
That is, if the tree isnt currently pretending to be dead and/or low on power again, because its playing another mindgame.
5365105
Bro, you can't just make claims that can't be proven.
i honestly think Equestria sadly stand no chance with he number of Hosts, the forces of Doom possess. the population of ponies in Equestria period can't rival maybe, 400,000 across the entire country and that's me high balling it. the larger monkry cities like Manehattin or Baltimare, look big but the populations seems lower there or the cities smaller then IRL.
5365105
what the fuck is astral twilight?
Press X to Doubt.
5366333 The Tree of Harmonies Avatar from "what lies beneath"
5365146 What makes you think, that i dont have evidence? I mean sure, ive exagarated a bit, but not by much. The Spirit of Harmony has several abilities, every single one of which can be considered a gamebreaker.
5372755
I didn't say you had no evidence, I said your claims can't be proven.
Like I already said, 2nd Age Middle Earth is on a completely different level to Equestria. It's basically impossible to compare the two properly, so it boils down to personal opinion almost entirely.
In my personal opinion, the Spirit of Harmony can't stand up to an almost-literal-archangel.
Did you know that Barad-dûr, AKA: the Black Tower of Mordor, stands just shy of a mile tall, and has no mortar in its construction? It's not held up by conventional means, but rather Sauron's will. In other words, the tower comprised of an unknown metallic substance stands at nearly a mile tall for no other reason than that Sauron wants it to.
And it's explained somewhat in deeper lore that this is not a difficult feat for him. It takes none of his concentration. Holding up thousands of tons of stone and/or metal is something he can just do.
5372779
um, did you forget, that the tree of harmony willed an entire underground dungeon in existence, that contained a replica of mt. eris? Also ponies arent as weak as you think, unicorn twilight is considered physically weak, by pony standards, rd and aj even mock her for that in fall weather friends, but she was still capable of lifting a 4 ton boulder, as did rarity, and survive pianos fallig on her head. thats the average powerlevel. Also cadance and shining can use their combined magic to repel an entire army, and while i dont know exactly how durable orcs are, im pretty sure they would at least break a leg after being flung several miles across the countryside.
Also even if ponies themselves were are no match, that doesnt take into account their superweapons, like the crystal heart and the elements. cozy glows circle can negate magic on a global scale, which would prevent sauron from keeping his tower thingy together.
Also military intelligence is also important, sauron was looking for his own ring for how long? The cutiemap however was able to instantly locate the pillars artifacts in an instant when they were needed. Also it can predict the future, throughout the entire show, its been guiding the ponies towards their happy ending.
In season 5, It sent the mane 6 to starlights village, so set off starlights revenge plot, then gave missions to everyone, except for twilight, to make her feel left out, so that she would suffer a breakdown, when discord spent time with everone else, so she would learn, that even a princess has flaws and recognize jealousy, which are lessons that allowed her to convert starlight in the finale, which is important for the plot of season 6, as starlight saves both the crystal empire from flurry heart, as well as beat chrysalis.
And when cozy glow came to twilights school, instead of strangeling her outright like the mean 6, or trapping her in a dungeon like the student 6, or simply TELLING anyone about her evil plans, allowed her to create a her doomsday device, just to prove to neighsay, that racism is bad. It also let chrysalis escape, without telling the ponies what shes up to, since she was still needed in the final fight, without her, cozy and tirek wouldnt have been able to get the bell and overthrow grogar/discord, which would have meant no epic final fight, that convinces all the other tribes, that friendship is awesome
In short, it made sure, that everyone is "where they need to be"
astral twilights omni-awareness and future calculating abilities make it impossible for sauron to outsmart the ponies.
plus the elements can smite any adversary, even reality warping chaos gods. btw equestria has a reality warping chaos god on their side.
Also sauron lost to frodo and his ragtag group of friends.
The tree of harmony never lost, even when a badguy was too powerful for twilight and her ragtag group of friends, the tree can just smite them for the ponies.
In fact the tree could have solved any problem instantly, if it wasnt holding back all the time, to allow twi and the others to get character development, so basically the tree was playing with a self-imposed handicap the whole time, cause its goal was world peace instead of world domination.
5372755
What about it?
5372786
That's a whole buncha more stuff that can't be proven.
No offense, but are you just trying to become the patron saint of the snowball fallacy?
5373005
you asked, who astral twilight was.
5373022
what about it cant be proven?
while i do admit to some speculating on the trees motivations, (because the show doesnt spell it out for us), I also list several feats from the show,
you keep saying theres no proof. Do you have proof for the things you say?
Like, you say that sauron is super powerful because he can keep a tower together. Keeping a tower together is a powerful feat, but constructing an underground dungeon with a replica of mt eris is not?
average Ponies are repeatedly shown to be more powerful than humans, being able to lift several times their own bodyweight etc. also they get smacked through walls and trees and generally survive stuff, that would kill humans.
the "superpowers" the equestria girl cast receive are mostly just normal powers in the pony world. Like human!AJs superstrength is just pony!AJs regular strength. Its considered superhuman in the human world, but in equestria, it wasnt enough to score AJ even one first prize in the national rodeo thingy.
And then there are ponies like maud and rockhoof, that can create earthquakes with their strength alone.
Humans would have a hard time surviving in equestria, but they do just fine in midde earth. I mean, would a regular farmer in middle earth routinely deliver pies to the other side of a fireswamp, thats inhabited by a man eating chimera? I mean AJ did freak out, when Applebloom tried to do it by herself, but shes like 10. when granny smith gave the quest to her, she acted like its not a big deal.
As for the trees extremely vague and hard to prove motivations:
All of the map missions have had effects way beyond the characters involved. Like the episode where rarity and pinkie went to save that restaurant, it didnt just affect the restaurant, but started a culinary revolution in canterlot.
the episode in manehattan even especially tells us the plan: the map could have sent twilight to easily and instantaneously fix the festival with her magic, but that wouldnt have fixed the lethargy of the ponies living in this town. By sending AJ and Rarity, even though it would be harder for them, without twilights magic, it taught the townsfolk, that you dont need to have superpowers to solve your problems, if you split up the work between multiple ponies.
The map clearly puts a lot of thought into the missions it sends the ponies on, so why would it just ignore stuff like chrysalis trying to meddle with the elements, or cozy glow setting up a magic circly directly underneath its roots, if it wasnt part of some bigger plan?
It constructed a dungeon, with trials for the students, to overcome the doubt cozy planted in them, so it must have known, that cozy was up to something, heck, why was the tree at the school in the first place, if it didnt know about anything?
It can strangle the mean 6 and put gallus in a shrinking deathtrap, so why didnt it just dispose of cozy when she started to drain the magic? Because it was more beneficial, to have the students defeat her. If cozy hadnt drained the magic, neighsay wouldnt have seen the error of his ways. That would also explain the trees cryptic words "you are where you need to be" what did it mean by that, if it isnt some foreshadowing of the student six saving equestria at the end of the season?
If you object to any of what i said, youre free to tell me, but please tell me which points you object to and why. saying "that cant be proven" without specifying which points youre reffering to, or what counterpoints you have against them, isnt really helpful.
Also I dont think Sauron and co are weak by any means, its just, by its nature, mlp is a crazier show. middle earth is more grounded in reality with humans living in it. equestria is more alien with higher power concepts, like the rulers are literally capable of moving sun and moon, but still get outmatched by even greater magical beings like discord who is literally a reality warper.
And in the end, neither of the two worlds would survive in the dragonball universe, where literally everyone can blow up planets without even trying.
5373031
oh, i thought you were responding on my "press X to doubt" comment. my bad, thanks.
still don't feel like they could be that useful tho.
5373079
i mean, the elements are literally a instant win button. And then they became sentient and started developing new powers as the plot demands. "like all living things i change as I grow, and as ive grown, so have my abilities"
however, in later seasons the spirit seems to be more into mind games though, so it would probably manipulate events from the shadows and make sure, that everyone is "where they need to be" so everything turns out fine.
In the equestria girl movies, the elements literally change the ruling for magic to get the outcome they want.
5373102
But like, if even one of them is not available, the entire thing fails. Feels like it would be almost too easy for the armies of Mordor and it's allies to just, straight up kill Fluttershy or Rarity, and then elements no workies.
5373067
There's a difference between "there's no proof" and "it can't be proven".
The snowball fallacy is when you take events or implications and use those to draw spurious, tangential conclusions. IE: "[X] is a thing that happened; therefore, [completely unrelated conclusion] must also be possible or true."
It's not just that there's no proof of those things true. It's that it's impossible to prove that they're true, because you made them up.
For example:
You bring up that the Spirit of Harmony can find the locations of people and objects it has deep, direct connections to; and from there, draw the conclusion that it must therefore be omniscient and omnipresent.
Do you understand?
You can't just make up headcanons and pretend that they're true.
At least, not if you want people to take your points seriously.
5373486 Ok, thanks, thats the kind of arguement i can work with.
In the example you provide, you say, that it can only locate objects, it has a connection to. However the map was also capable of locating all the areas that were rich in dark magic, like the well of shade, and it has routinely located friendship problems of people, it has never met before, like for example the indian restaurant ponies, or the hooffield and mccolts, or the kirin village. Or for the very first ever map mission, it located starlights village in the middle of nowhere. If it needs a connection of some sorts, how does it keep finding ponies, it has no connection with whatsoever? It needs to be able to see those locations somehow, otherwise it wouldnt be able to choose the correct set of ponies for the job. And if its able to scan those areas from a distance, to detect if ponies disagree with each other, it should be able to locate any magical items as well, as its established by discord, that its possible to detect shifts in energy fields.
It has also shown the ability to replicate Lunas ability to create shared dreams between the student six, in the beginning of season 9, I dont know if that has anything to do with its problem detecting ability, but if it can access the minds and memories of people from a distance (Luna accessed Sweetie Belles AND Rarities memories of her fifth birthday party to solve a missunderstanding), so even if it didnt have a straight up omni-awareness, it would still be very hard to hide anything from the tree. So it could easily locate the ring, by reading golums mind (and that one would stick out because ALL his dreams are prolly about his PRECIOUS)
5373491
There you go again, right off the bat. You give one example of the tree doing a thing, and then assume that means it can always to that thing in all circumstances with no cost to itself.
Roots.
We know that the tree has roots throughout Equestria, and even past its borders. The tree thrives on harmony and is harmed by discord, so naturally it would be able to sense people giving off discordant energy.
Which, by the by, is another point. If the premise is that Equestria just appears off the coast of Middle Earth, that would imply that the tree sustained significant damage to its roots. Which, if you didn't know is a massively traumatic and damaging event for plants. Especially trees, whose roots tend to be sturdier than most other plants, but as a trade-off, are also more difficult to repair when they are damaged.
"It once cast a spell similar to another spell we'd seen before. Therefore, it is capable of replicating all forms of magic, and also reading peoples' minds from a distance."
No. That's not how that works. Stop it with the snowball fallacy. Nobody thinks it's cute.
This is the second age, bro. Before Sauron lost the ring. It doesn't need to be located, because everyone already knows where it is. On Sauron's finger.
This is also before anyone knew that Sauron and the ring were intimately linked. At this point, those few who even knew about the ring just figured is was yet another powerful weapon he was wielding.
Ah, and since I didn't properly explain before: Remember how Sauron was holding up a small mountain's worth of stone with his mind just because he wanted to? That's something he was doing with a fraction of the strength he was capable of with the ring.
Sauron without the ring was described as being a mere shadow of his former self, and he was still capable of threatening the entire world. To be quite frank, the only reason Sauron was defeated at all is because Isildur and Frodo both had plot armor. Also, because Gollum fucked everything up but in a way that just so happened to work out.
5373541
I hit the post button by mistake.
5373544
No Problem