Rage Review: Resist and Bite (Chapter 9) · 12:41am Mar 26th, 2020
Chapter 9: Special gadgets and plans
Captain Wei reaches the Kirin village, and once again the omniscient scanners fail to detect the Kirins, which makes me wonder if this is a Kirin power.
Why not? The Kirin canonically hid from the Equestrian Ponies for a very long time.
"Lieutenant general Jin, This is Captain Wan Long Wei me and my squad have arrived in the Kirin village. But there are no signs of any civilization here. Just some empty houses and trees."
Once again, we see the word "civilization" used in a manner implying that it means "people," as houses are of course a clear sign of "civilization." This makes me think that it's an English as a Second Language issue on the part of the Author.
Loud and clear captain Wan. But consider this, my men only exterminated the leader of the village and only captured a few of the Kirins residing there, and some might be hiding so I want you and your team to arrest them and send them to me. And if they try to run, shoot them.]
As always in this Story, a bit unnecessarily verbose, but it provides us some information.
The Chinese aware that they killed Rain Shine, the village leader, but that most of the Kirin probably escaped. Why they bothered to attack an out-of-the way village inhabited by a hybrid Pony sub-Kind is anyone's guess, but maybe they were worried about them as a potential threat to their lines of communication?
Also, General Jin wants the others captured, or killed if not possible to capture them.
I see a possible logistical problem here, as there's no way that they could transport the population of the whole village in their one ATV truck. But of course if they succeed in taking the whole village prisoner, the Chinese could always send more trucks to reinforce Captain Wei, so okay.
Wei orders his men to disembark and attack.
After that, the six Chinese swat units got off the truck armed with assault rifles, pistols, one wielding a swat shield and sharp combat knives. And they were also wearing dark helmets and masks.
This exemplifies a Story-wide problem, in that this is the third or fourth time that we've been treated to a detailed description of the Chinese numbers and eqipment. Which is a bit redundant.
Story, we get that the troops have rifles, pistols, combat knives and one shield, and that they are otherwise wearing their helmets and masks, as before. There's no reason for them to not be carrying their standard equipment. We don't need to be explicitly told that they have this equipment, again and again and again.
They were scrutinizing the village searching for the fugitive Luster Dawn and the infiltrator Luster Dawn. And they are also observing their surroundings to see if there were any Kirins there remaining. If they find some, they can arrest them, but if they try to assault them. They will instantly resort to killing them.
Extreme redundancy, as we just heard General Jin give the orders to Captain Wei, and Captain Wei give the orders to his men. Again, we don't need to be told and retold the contents to those orders, especially because (in a case of literal "Chinese Whispers") the details of those orders keep changing.
Luckily for the Good Guys, Charlie is watching with his own omniscient scanner.
"Oh my, it is those humans who have killed our leader." Autumn said with a whimper.
Yes yes, we know, all the non-Human characters are total wimps. Grind this lesson into our faces with your steel-toed combat boots once more, Story, lest we imagine that any of them are worthy in their own right!
'"And, why are they dark colored this time?" She asked.
"Well they are called swat. Full name special weapons and tactics, and they are a law enforcement unit which uses specialized or military equipment and tactics." Charlie replied which sent chills down to Autumns spine.
I'm not sure why Charlie -- and Autumn Blaze, are more impressed by SWAT MP's than they are by regular motorized infantry. By definition, troops use "military equipment and tactics."
I suspect that either the Chinese PLA SWAT MP's actually are some sort of elite troop type, or that Author has confused them with Special Forces, which are for real elite troops.
Charlie then gets an improbable readout on the Chinese forces which gives him not only their ranks but also their ages and NAMES. This implies that he's patched in directly to the Red Chinese personnel roster, which is remotely possible but logically requires some explanation. Maybe he gained a permanent backdoor into the whole Chinese PLA system when he hacked into their teleporter back in his own lab?
After Charlie finished scanning the six swat units, he began to formulate a plan to defeat them. Obviously he can't tell everyone to charge towards them and deliver any possible attacks because the swat team could just shoot them or pin them down with their adroit combat experience in their training.
At some point in this Story, Charlie seems to have advanced in status among the Kirin from "suspicious and probably hostile alien Invader" to "designated military commander of our village." Because Charlie assumes that he's in command, and nobody assumes anything else.
Well, these poor native Kirins were in trouble, but now Mighty (Chinese-Australian) Whitey Once-Human Alicorn is on the job!
Now this isn't entirely unrealistic -- in a crisis, frightened people will often for real follow the lead of the first person who doesn't show fear and tells them what to do. But, given the degree to which the Kirin distrusted him before, this probably requires some explanation -- which Story, of course, fails to provide.
Charlie looked at his right and saw that there was also a large bush there big enough to hide fourteen people or ponies. He then looked at the left and saw a path that leads back to the entrance of the village, it has a few hiding areas, but it was worth a try. He looked at the twenty two Kirins behind him and has a great plan in his head.
At some point, eight more Kirins appear to have shown up. This is never mentioned nor explained, but there were 14 before and there are 22 now. Ah well, why not?
I've already done the Blackadder "cunning plan" riff, so there's no point in doing it again.
"Okay, here's what I have in mind. I will split all you Kirins to groups of eleven." Charlie told them, then he looked at Autumn blaze. "Autumn Blaze, do you think that you can bring ten armed Kirins with you and hide in that bush over there to prepare for a stealth attack?" Charlie asked as he pointed at the bush.
Of course Autumn Blaze can do this; she's not a moron. Heck, a pride of lions could conceive of the basic plan that Charlie's outlining.
"I can do that." Autumn Blaze replied with a nod.
"Good." Charlie said with a proud smile, then looked at the other eleven Kirins on his right.
"Do you all think that you can take the left footpath and block the entrance of your village with your magical horns so that the swat team can't escape?" Charlie asked.
The eleven Kirins hesitated when they heard his order. But, they stuffed their agitation down and nodded.
1. Charlie's proprietary pride in the Kirins is a little bit insulting (though they don't notice it under the circumstances). It implies that he regards them not only as his but as rather cowardly and simple-minded, since he's basically just been impressed that they can follow the order to "hide and ambush the enemy." Which is not all that complicated, and in fact is exactly what they had just finished doing to himself!
2. It's interesting that there's time to give detailed orders when the enemy is literally right at the gates. In the previous encounter with the Chinese MP's, there was no time to even dive for cover. Time seems conveniently flexible in these tactical encounters.
3. My objection in "2" is of course explained by the fact that the first was a mandated encounter with no game-option to prepare, while this is a battle and this is the Deploy Forces preparatory phase before the actual fighting rounds. Reality, of course, doesn't work like that -- this is pure game logic.
To demonstrate this absurdity, Charlie then says:
"Luster Dawn, you and I will stay here and keep watch of the swat units while the Kirins do their part. And if you see any of them looking at their left and right at the Kirins locations tell me and I'll signal them." Charlie told her.
and Luster Dawn, her brain suddenly switching on as the loose wire finally flops into place and electricity bridges the gap once more, asks:
"Okay, but... how are you going to signal them?"
which is a very salient point!
In response ...
Charlie then reached into his backpack and pulled out some earpieces, but to Luster Dawn and the Kirins, they were earphones for singing on stage in a concert.
One doesn't use "earphones" to "sing on stage in a concert." One uses microphones. Which look absolutely nothing like earpieces. Nor do the tiny little microphones often included with early 21st-century earbuds look all that much like the sort of microphones used in Equestria's early 20th-century technology entertainment industry.
"Alright you guys, listen up. These are called earpieces, used for communication purposes. And this is how you wear them." Charlie said as he began demonstrating "First you run this wire at the back of your neck, and clip it on." He said, and Luster Dawn's th the Kirins followed his instructions.
"Next, take the coil tube and run it to the top of your ear." Charlie said as he showed them the coil and ran it up his ear. And everyone did as he instructed again, then a small mechanical noise could be heard which surprised them all.
How convenient for all concerned that Charlie was thoughtful enough to bring earpieces customized for Ponies and Kirins. Or did Author forget the anatomical differences?
But let's just accept that whatever model he brought were generic enough in design that they fit equinoid ears. Why not?
Why are they surprised that they hear a noise in what have been described to them as communications equipment?
Charlie then demonstrates how to use the devices.
Well and good. But does Author realize that Charlie is basically training them on new equipment before deploying into battle while the enemy is in approach march? Not impossible, but kind of dangerous, don't you think?
But of course, this is the Prep Phase of a structured game, so Talking Is A Free Action.
The Kirins go to their hiding places, and the SWAT team enters the village.
Charlie unnecessarily says:
"Good, now tell your Kirins to prepare to throw the spears either at the swat units legs, chest and elbows."
In context, Charlie is giving orders to people who routinely use spears on how to use these spears. Or, more charitably, how to take advantage of the weaknesses in the Chinese troops' armor.
The problem with this is that Charlie has no special knowledge of how to use pre-gunpowder thrown weapons, nor (really) should he have any special knowledge of the enemy armor schemes. To the extent that he can see the armor schemes, so can the Kirin, and they have a better idea of the capabilities of their own weapons.
Again, Story assumes that the Kirins are simpletons and Charlie the only person here with a functioning intellect.
But suddenly, one of the swat units was about to turn to his right which made Charlie's eyes widen.
"All you Kirins on the left, get down. A swat unit is about to turn to his right and face your location."
A minor gripe I've had for a while now. An individual soldier is not in normal parlance a "unit." That term is usually reserved for a group of soldiers or units assigned to the same larger unit.
More importantly, "all you Kirins on the left" (Charlie should be giving the order to their unit commander, not the group) can see the SWAT trooper turning, and they presumably know that they don't want to be seen by them.
Still more importantly, as an individual man turning happens pretty fast, the most Charlie should be able to say in this situation is "Get down!" He doesn't have time for more, if even that much.
When the swat unit looked at his right and saw nothing, he turned back and returned to his work.
Isn't part of his "work," when reconning a hostile village, to be on the alert for the enemy?
Swat unit Lam Xie Li was looking behind a tree but saw nothing. He then looked at his right and saw a hoof in the bushes in the distance.
Bushes don't work like that. They don't just grow up at the level of their highest foliage and lack lower foliage. Their sides also have foliage. Hence, they offer (soft) cover from top to bottom.
Line-of-sight also doesn't work like that. Even if the bush did lack foliage right at the bottom, since Trooper Li is standing, he could not see the Kirin's hooves.
Li reports the sighting, and Captain Wei orders Li to engage the hostile.
A shot rings out, and the Kirin is hit.
BANG!*
"Auughh!" A Kirin screamed in pain.
"What the?" Charlie and Luster Dawn said in unison with traumatized expressions. Charlie looked at his right and saw the swat units shooting the Kirins.
Well, duh, Galaxy Brain Charlie. What did you think was going on?
The battle commences.
The eleven Kirins hiding in the bushes at the foot walk were running back but many of them were shot at their backs. Some took cover behind trees but some bullets pierced through them and hit their chests which made them fall on the ground bleeding.
So one of the Kirin squads has been shocked into breaking cover, falls back taking losses, and then finds better cover. For some reason the Chinese rifles can "pierce through" the trees, which is rather odd for 7.62mm rifle founds, but whatever.
This is actually intelligent writing, because it shows that Author is aware of morale issues.
Charlie orders Autumn Blaze's group to attack.
Captain Wei spots this and tries to fall back, but not before the Kirins can throw their spears.
The spear flew up in the air for a moment then they began to fall to the ground in a hug speed. And the swat units were hit either in their legs, back or chests except for Lam Xie Li who has made it in cover in the nick of time. After the spears were finished raining down on him and his team, he looked at his colleagues and saw that most of them were down on the ground two had spears stabbed through their back and two were scratched on their legs and chests unable to get up, and the sight devastated him. Lam then looked at his right and saw his Captain on the ground with a spear stabbed through his chest, and Lam must've assumed that he has been killed. Lam then reached the captain's belt with his right hand and pulled out his walkie talkie. He placed it near his mouth and clicked on the button trying desperately to contact the Lieutenant General.
So basically, almost the entire six-man team has been killed or taken out of the fight by wounds or demoralization.
This is why one shouldn't try to take a hostile village with just six men, even if one's men are better armed. A really small force like that is too militarily, dare I say, fragile. It doesn't take more than a few casualties to render it incapable of effectively fighting.
Trooper Lam manages to reported back what is happening by radio to General Jin.
Jin tries to rally Lam, but while this is still happening, the Kirins capture Lam.
The Kirins have won.
It is discovered that three of the Chinese team are dead. The remaining three (two of them wounded) are made prisoner.
Lt. Chan, speaking to Sgt. Lee, then accuses Charlie of choosing the wrong side:
This teenager has turned into a wicked murderer like the rest of the creatures in Equestria. And now, he is going to slaughter us.
It develops that Charlie can speak Chinese, which is actually not that surprising since he's of Chinese descent.
Charlie replies to Chan's comment:
"Listen to me you three. I wasn't the one who provoked all of this to you. This is all on you to blame, and all I wanted to do was to have a simple negotiation with your Lieutenant General and tell him to get his men and you guys out of Equestria because the creatures here are kind and peaceful. They have not even do anything to any of you."
but Chan responds:
"It looks like the news from your country has deleted the video from what has happened to our country. You can side with them as long as you want to Charlie Lam. And eventually, you will see the truth of these vile creatures."
Now, one might think that Charlie would be very curious as to what Chan specifically means, but why ask?
The three surviving SWAT troopers are sent back to General Jin in their truck.
Charlie and Luster Dawn cuffed the two of the injured swat units and placed them in the back swat truck. And the unharmed one at the driver's seat. And their guns have been obliterated by Charlie's and Luster Dawn's magic beams.
Why "obliterate" the guns? Wouldn't the Kirin, and Equestria in general, benefit from capturing more technologically-advanced weapons from the foe?
Also, why didn't Charlie or Luster Dawn use their "magic beams" in the actual battle? Forgetting to do so probably got Kirin killed in that fight!
Charlie entrusts his former prisoners with a message to General Jin:
"Tell your Lieutenant General that you have just found me and Luster Dawn. And I have a message for him, if he tries to send more police officers, swat units or soldiers after me and Luster Dawn, tell them to bring me in only so that I can have a very simple negotiation with him.
Charlie tries to recruit Autumn Blaze and the Kirin to join their quest to assemble a resistance against the PLA, but the Kirin refuse:
When Autumn and the remaining Kirins heard this, they immediately began to tremble in anxiety.
"Y-you want us to fight them?"
"Yes."
"Uh...uh... oh right! I just remember, we have something to do so... uh goodbye!" Autumn said as she ran back into her house as well as the remaining Kirins.
Notice what a contemptuous opinion of the Kirin the Show has? The Kirin actually have good reason to be afraid: they're a small village and have taken significant losses at the hands of the Chinese; they also have no particular reason to trust either Charlie or Luster Dawn (especially since Luster has never told anyone she's an agent of Princess Twilight Sparkle).
Yet the Kirin don't say this. They instead choose the sort of foolish, feet-shuffling lame excuse which might have been assigned to a "cowardly Negro" in a farce written a century or more ago. ("Feets, doan' fail me now!")
This is because, clearly, no NPC's have any fundamental purpose in life deeper or nobler than aiding the PC Protagonist. How dare the Kirins love their own lives or those of their comrades? Cowards!
So Charlie and Luster Dawn press on.
To "Griffinstone Cloudsdale!"
(Whatever the heck that means).
They didn't expect to find the embezzler Luster Dawn, felon Luster Dawn, or Summertime Fun™ Luster Dawn in the village, but were prepared to apprehend any if they showed themselves.
"Darn, my scanner's damaged. I should also get their blood types, birthdays, and food allergies."
"Dance! Dance like your lives depend on it, because they do!"
I won't lie, it was deeply satisfying to read that bit.
The Flimflam brothers recently performed a merger between the two. No one is entirely sure how or why, the brothers included.
If you know what you're writing about, it can be a neat thing to have a little Gun Porn, or something... but of course, the appeal wears out its welcome quickly if you're A: being repetitive, B: it's rather out of place and a bit intrusive (goes hand-in-hand with A), and C: if you're making your lack of knowledge outside of inaccurate movies/TV shows/cartoons apparent (like, for instance, shooting at a throne to shatter it).
(not that I'd consider any of this to be an attempt at that)
It wasn't as if he was running around throwing mind control powers about willy-nilly. It was more like... he'd turned Equestria into a stage, and our lives a play, with himself in the starring role. Except it was a fairly terrible play because, as the star, he was the leader, the one who came up with all the good ideas, and in reality his ideas were fairly stupid, so everypony else had to play the role of idiots in order to let him shine.
- Not The Hero
(guess they're too prone to Bavarian Fire Drills)
It's okay, you can also just upload some computer virus to the alien mothership or something, to defeat them, just like in Independence Day!Pshhh, reverse engineering? Directly using their own technology against them? That's for intelligent beings, that actually understand the principles behind war.
Because magic just can't be useful in this story, those silly ponies are so weak with their abilities. To give an example of a spoiler of the most recent chapter as of me writing this (it has "vs" in the title; morbid curiosity keeps getting me)... apparently a human can shrug off a magic blast attack from Twilight, and then get right back up to beat her without major complications, because of his "vest". Yeah... no, lol.
Because why would they be allowed to possess self-preservation without being condemned?
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I think Author meant to write "the infiltrator Charlie Lam" but put the wrong name in. That's an easy error to make -- I kept flipping "Snips" and "Snails" or (even more hilariously) having "Snails" talking to Glittershell (they're basically the same person) in early drafts of Fools and Drunks, and I think some of that even slipped out into early published versions.
The only way Charlie's scanner can possibly be giving him all this information is if the scanner can read the Chinese PLA personnel records or get it off some sort of IFF chips the troops are carrying on them. While either is possible, such would be precisely the sort of details which would be interesting to include in Story, as opposed to the constant repetitions of the equipment lists and the shape of the riot shield.
(Incidentally, did you notice that, despite having a riot shield, the troopers never got to use it in the situation in which it would have actually been highly-valuable -- namely, defending themselves against thrown spears?)
It was deeply-satisfying to me to finally get to call some humans "fragile," after we've been hearing about how fragile powerhouses like Alicorns and Dragons inexplicably are in Story.
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Yeah.
Detailed description of weapons and technology is cool when the descriptions are at all relevant to the story and are done ACCURATELY. Here, Author is describing how he thinks weapons and electronics and combat work, but his concepts of them seem to come from computer games, without the background knowledge of military technology and history that would let him to know just what aspects the games simplify or distort or outright make up, for play to be more fun.
Notice that the Kirin only need "how to ambush" spelled out to them when Charlie is commanding them? They had no trouble ambushing Charlie -- and they caught him by complete surprise, and might have been able to kill him had they been so minded, despite his Alicorn powers!
Author means to depict Charlie as a brilliant commander. He comes off to me as the sort of meddling manager who insists on telling one to do everything, including things that one is presumed to know, such as "Talk into the phone" (I work in telemarketing, and have for over a decade, and I knew how to do that after my first hour on my first job). For instance, the bit where he tells the Kirin how to throw their spears, despite the fact that they know how to use those spears, and there's no evidence that Charlie's ever thrown a spear in his life, is characteristic of his command style.
And I still keep forgetting that Charlie is now a pony. Seriously, I keep imagining a human doing all that nonsense.
That's a really big bush. Most big bushes I've hidden in (or behind, branches are a thing that can make hiding uncomfortable if not tricky) could only fit about two or three people. Perhaps a couple could fit five. Perhaps he's looking at a hedge, that's bound to have quite a few spaces big enough to fit one or two ponies, though that's actually multiple bushes and not 'a' bush. But, then again, hiding that many people in the bushes really only works when there are multiple bushes.
I can't believe this story compelled me to harp on shrubbery.
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As far as I can tell, I don't think the author puts much thought at all into the main character being a pony now (which a symptom of such being a distinct lack of "hey, how do I adapt to four legs," without even a decent handwave so much as attempted, and a lack of other things, like "it's weird, having these wings, how do I move them," and trying to do just that, or a lack of running his tongue amongst his teeth and finding them different, less pointy bits involved with canines, or why his physical body state in terms of fitness back when he was a human supposedly matters after transforming into a pony, and the list goes on). If it makes any sense, I think a way to describe how it works with "our beloved hero"
(which, of course you're meant to read in a sarcastic tone)is something along the lines of "he's a human that's wearing an alicorn pony costume, except it's enchanted, so he benefits."It doesn't help that the narrative isn't any good at acknowledging that "a human who isn't a human anymore doesn't look like a human matching the description of what they looked like when they were human, or even have similar coloring, as a general rule," judging from how the Chinese Army recognized him magically, as Jordan pointed out earlier. I don't think there's been any dialogue along the lines of "you betrayed our race, became one of these... things," have there? Or is my memory failing me here?
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There seems to be no acknowledgement of any problem with suddenly becoming an Alicorn, other than Charlie freaking out. It does take Charlie time to figure out how to use his Alicorn powers (though nowhere near as much time as it should, even in the MLP-verse), but no time at all to master basic Pony actions such as walking, talking, manipulating objects in his hooves, and so forth.
And yes -- it seems to be given that all of Charlie's physical skills, learned as a Human, carry through into his new form.
To be fair, Princess Twilight's did as well in the Equestria Girls movie. However, even she had moments of trouble, such as when she first tried to walk, or pick up things with her new hands.
Charlie -- well I guess he's just smarter than Purple Smart, eh?
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Yeah -- I didn't even think about it, but Story does say "bush" rather than "stand of bushes" or "hedge" (incidentally, this being a village, there's a perfectly good reason why there might be conveniently linear hedges next to pathways -- ornamental barriers). It seems to me that Author is assuming a linear hedge, as depicted in a computer game, without wondering why the "bush" is so linear. Or simply doesn't realize the difference in connotation between "bush" and "hedge."
The Knights Who Say "Ni" demand ... a shrubbery!
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Which, of course, isn't something that ever, y'know, weirded him out a bit?
Right? Because "holy moly, equinoids here can do that with their hooves? How does that work exactly?" (which with an inquisitive mind, like a "genius" like him should have, would not be out of place, would give a little character)
Gary Stuness OP, plz nerf.
...Y'know what? I guess I may as well do a review of this thing, in your stead, if you're done here (can't quite blame ya if so).
(First one will cover two chapters, thinking about doing the rest)
Chapter 10/11 (counting the "Prologue" as chapter 1 on the latter): Rough talk with the griffons
Hmm... optimism, okay then.
And so our stunning and brave heroes are on a quest to recruit the Griffons for help... what could possibly go wrong?
Okay then, Instant Expert. But that's well-known by now.
I'd be inclined to side with Luster's irritation if anything...Do I even need to explain why this is fucking stupid? Pointing. Out. The. Problem. Doesn't. Make. It. Disappear. For crying out loud, how are you Twilight's student, for the millionth time, or Starlight's child? You shouldn't be Too Dumb To Live, and this truly does feel a lot like Not The Hero Anon's work. Dammit.
Like... a helicopter? Peculiar way to describe someone ascending with their wings. What, is he spinning around the whole way up or something? Are his wings rotating around his body to generate lift? Really makes you think...
...I think that's a pacing trainwreck (capitalization aside), if that was in one paragraph. I mean, come on, you go from "whoa there's death and destruction" to "oh look Luster's blushing?" I'm not sure what they were going for there.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but maybe it's a bit weird about the Scanner of Convenience, considering the following (as you pointed out in this blog post)...
...where'd you guys come from? And why are you two so good at getting surrounded? Your scanner sucks!
(Meaningless place for all she knows, and for the umpteenth time, you're. Not. Human. Anymore.
(emphasis mine, on the bold)
Rookie mistake, no, with the association?
Gee, how kind of you to remember that... for once, Luster.
Or... wait for it... you guys are stupid when it comes to negotiating.
Next stop, there...
back to da Stooges.
(I'm trying to make a bit of an effort to not include pointless non-English language text)
So... again, how did you know an alicorn that doesn't look like a human... was actually him? And Luster can't be a "prisoner" if she's free, unless you have the word "escaped" before that word. Just sayin'.
I know, I know, we were all astonished by the boy's transformation too... but not for the same reason.
And again, why would a Captain need to know these things? Why would marksmanship be important? (and of course, bad expositing as to why a character is obviously a threatening villain)
Oh? A Captain is your top choice? Again, COs don't do this, especially not alone.
(was it in doubt that'd happen?)
oh yay, tracking.
Those evil, vile, little Chicoms! They made that garden into a parking lot! (but for real, how long have they been in Equestria? I don't remember) edited to add: a month
Should I even question how it's tracking them both? Or... am I asking too many questions?
[END OF CHAPTER 10/11]
Chapter 11/12: Rough negotiations in the Changeling Kingdom
[One exposition dump later, regarding oh-so-amazing human landscapes later, no really]
Aside from it arguably feeling inauthentic how easily impressed she was at some of the explanations (like, uh... you have cloud cities in Equestria, and skyscrapers, but Jordan179, at the very least, knows that, I know that... etc, etc)... well...
It's kind of repetitive to paraphrase what Luster Dawn was giggling at a sentence ago, no? I'm leaning on "yes."
And here we are!
Hmm, so you're jumping straight to "we've definitely gotta bust our way inside, there's definitely no other way in..." okay then?
Umpteenth time: they're physically ponies. Do you treat all of your guests this way, Pharynx(?)? They're probably not with the invaders, y'know?
(Well, to be fair, they didn't actually damage it by then. A "state your intent" would've gone a long way, been easier; guess he's actually addicted to the sack song-and-dance, huh? Based off of one episode?)
(Is that the first time Charlie's color as an alicorn was mentioned? Hmm.)
(you could've, y'know, asked Luster Dawn about that, like "who's the Queen or King of Equestria" or something, right? Found out why? But, anyway, moving on)
And this might be shocking to the author, but the following is true:
Changelings are shapeshifters. They make wonderful spies due to that, and they can also easily infiltrate the ranks of the enemy due to that fact, assassinate them, steal their equipment, etc. Subterfuge is what a Changeling is good at, and that was what one of Chrysalis' biggest failures as a Changeling was, her general addiction to the spotlight, decreasing the use of subterfuge the second she had power, mostly in general (not that she didn't come close to having it work out anyhow, multiple times, though her sadism and ego are huge weaknesses anyhow).
...Is it bad if I laughed at this? "Prepare to be enslaved?" Kicking the gates open? What the hell were they made out of? Papier-mâché?
Oh dear, here we go again...
More curb-stomping incoming...
Surprisingly, this one actually seems to grasp the concept of "gun > fists," unnecessary and stupid charging aside, and questionable nature of it being so easy aside, going in solo I think it was?
(what's more astonishing is how you had vital information on YouTube, on your "super special secret teleporter," but sure, shill the main character even more why doncha?)
(was there any reason Twilight couldn't do that? Or why you didn't skip straight to magic? Or why you let 'em go? Or why Luster didn't do anything? As per usual. And again, wow, more shilling for Gary Stu.)
Also, parents... did he say anything specific? At all? What did he actually say that was so hurtful? How do you know he wasn't talking out of his hindquarters just to see what stuck?
And again, "No I'm not" isn't accurate. You were human. Your DNA wouldn't identify you as human in all likelihood.
...Yeah, like Thorax would do that, when even aside from it not fitting his personality, he had to deal with "being feared just because of his species" himself. And hello, would Luster Dawn just say "We're here on behalf of Princess Twilight Sparkle, and I'm her protege" already? Damn these guys suck at this.
(This is feeling quite formulaic, wouldn't you say, because they've made the same mistakes repeatedly and they're not learning.)
Maybe it's because both of you are terrible with negotiations? And because everyone's being idiots?
I can confirm with absolute certainty (in part because I'd CTRL + F'd every chapter for "Crystal Empire" and "Cadance," and so on) that the author forgot about Twilight's other family members, because it's never come up by now, not that I'd have confidence that they'd do anything other than swallow the Idiot Ball.
[END OF CHAPTER 11/12]
To be continued...
...if you don't mind; I can stop and bring this to a personal blog post or whatever if you wish
(Just one chapter reviewed, this post, and... I have a big question, pretty soon in, about firefighting... well actually multiple)
Chapter 12 OR 13: Failed confrontations in the dragons land
(well when the chapter title's like that... what could possibly go wrong? What could possibly happen? Will our beloved heroes succeed in convincing them?)
...and again, literally what was specific about what that bozo Captain said? He said "how would you think your parents will see you as," did he not?
(emphasis mine)
Uh... am I being woefully ignorant of firefighting tactics here, or does this not pass the smell test? Why is the skyscraper in danger of falling over? What? There isn't extremely, extremely hot jet fuel involved ala 9/11 weakening the steel's resistance to bending, or something, right? What the fuck's going on there? Why are they gonna topple it with explosives? I've never heard of that being an actual firefighting procedure in the history of ever, in regards to a skyscraper.
Please educate me if that actually makes sense.
...okay then? What. "Ride the currents?" Okay, this is the first thing that came to mind, regarding an MLP clip. (not that it's necessarily the best choice for a clip)
(emphasis mine)
I know that's supposed to be touching and all that (it wasn't), but that uh... felt stupider than some over-the-top action movie scene. Why would the sewers go to the ocean... What is this, Finding Nemo? Why didn't they all drown or something?
I'm... flabbergasted. How the hell am I supposed to make sense of this? This feels horribly nonsensical. Just... please help me if this actually makes any sense, in what is supposed to be a mundane setting, any of that, I beg of you.
My intuition says that no, no it probably doesn't, considering, but I'd gladly be proven wrong, because I just want the extreme confusion to go away.
I just can't conceive of a way this actually makes any sense, any of the above...
...you literally weren't even there, and furthermore were five-years old. How is it a "memory?!"
What in blazes is going on here? I didn't expect to be this thoroughly discombobulated, and that's saying something. Is this author trying to Discord me?
Okay, here we go again.
(Accept thy failures, and Imma hazard a guess and say, "nah, it's not gonna be a breeze")
(Uh... how would you know a dragon would even have a carotid artery pulse? Or a pulse anywhere? It stands to reason dragons don't necessarily have the same sort of circulatory system... right? Not to mention the thick scales/hide?)
(And it should go without saying, Dragons are always a threat. They should by all rights make brown bears look about as easy to kill as, what, squirrels in comparison, depending on the size? Why is it supposed to be plausible that it'd be a cakewalk to invade Equestria with dragons not an overly rare sight in Equestrian society, as of The Last Problem's seeming status quo? Even aside from Spike himself, as smart and strong as he is?)
And again, while it's not an inherent disadvantage, why are you using spears? Why are you not simply firebreathing them?
Why are they attacking ponies?
And yet again... I don't think humans with knives, or batons, is doing much of anything, to dragons. And how would you know what types of cartridges were used against them? Again? Why would small arms be particularly effective, anyhow?
sigh, that mistake again. "unusual name except for Luster Dawn."
Quick, you'll have a chance to redeem yourselves!
moment of truuuuth!
"Oh gosh golly gee willikers, we've only done that approach of (falsely) associating ourselves with the enemy like four times, and it's worked out well for us exactly never, so Imma dew it agaiiiiin! What could possibly go wrong! It's not like I could say 'they told me what they were when they invaded' or anything!"
You... freaking morons.
You should've left Charlie to die, to be honest, even if you're also culpable in that you cannot remember to say "Princess Twilight Sparkle's protege, here on behalf of Her Majesty, beseeching you for aid!" And for once, because it'd also benefit the protagonist, you remember to teleport.
But he has had something to do with screwing up in the same way in the introductions multiple times because God Forbid that you learn from your mistakes in the absolute slightest.
Yep, as I said before: apparently there aren't more alicorns around that you can ask for help.
[End of Chapter 12 OR 13]
...I think I'm done, for tonight at least. Will probably keep going.
So, after one epic failure in regards to how firefighting works, and how sewer pipes work, and in how flashbacks and character memories are supposed to work, and finally, how the main characters aren't learning a damn thing from their failures, on account of failing similarly every time... I guess they're going back to Canterlot?
Chapter 14: Slavery in Canterlot
And here we are, back to the (unjustifiably useless) Heroes of Equestria. Where apparently, they're getting punished for wall-building failures
Continue being Villain Stus?
What's your immediate plan, Rarity? Oh wait, you're just being a contrarian, aren't you?
Unfortunately for you guys, A: Cadance, Flurry Heart, and the Former Royal Sisters have fallen within a narrative Black Hole, never to be seen again, and B: those two are so stupid, and there's no reason you guys couldn't have sent Starlight Glimmer with them, to back them up. I mean, it'd only make sense, that idea, right? How hard can it be to get a magic suppression ring (that was awkwardly revised onto Twilight and Starlight, and no one else, in Chapter 3, the escape one) off along the way, or something? Would that take away from the main character's alleged awesomeness too much, him being outshined by character(s) who know more about magic than he by all rights, and is older, more experienced, to boot?
(repetitive description)
And can the author stop with the attempts at "oh look, poor child?" It doesn't work that well, when it's, well, this story. Also, "war zone?" Where's the active combat going on? You were defeated (unjustifiably so, mind you, but still).
Again, too much describing stuff we'd know by now that they have. And why not just say "baton" or something?
Hmm. Nah. Pretty sure she could teleport out, still. I don't see a reason why her magic would be so impaired, at all, do you? She could be a big threat with a tenth of her power. Also, what about the magic suppression rings that were added into the third chapter (onto only Twilight and Starlight, I repeat). Why isn't it a factor here? Could it be... a half-assed fix the author didn't think through much? Or are the ponies foolishly allowed to use magic for their work?
Again with the younglings in a transparent attempt to add salt to the wound?
...
(of course)
(pretty sure you could incinerate this guy, dragons)
Again, a "unit" isn't a single person.
Grabbing an alicorn by the horn? Are you kidding me? What, do you expect me to think that whoever's doing that wouldn't expect that to be a good way to get gored, or something?
Alicorn strength > horse strength > human strength. Need I elaborate on durability also?
Speaking of which, it would be one thing if Twilight was substantially weaker explicitly because she's not being fed well, but apparently, the implication never entered the mind of the author, here. True, she'd still be much, much more dangerous than any human if you divide her power by 20, but it'd be something to go off of, other than "she's been beaten down because she's sooooo fragile!"
Oh cool, you kill some slave who just happened to have the misfortune of standing there.
It would've probably made more sense if Jin murdered the mare who was being beaten due to having dropped something, instead of some dragon who just happened to be there. If he wasn't there to see that happen, he could've asked "hey, what happened here," and then killed her accordingly after getting the answer from his subordinate, to rub in to Twilight that her defiance got her killed, not some random slave who was uninvolved.
Slavery and demoralization is a cruel business, but I think the outlined scenario at least has more rhyme and reason to the cruelty, y'know?
How is Starlight lifting up a "giant rock" along with an "orange one next to her," one might wonder?
Is she using... magic to do so, magic that's unbound? Why can't she just kill Jin on the spot, then employ Teleportation to escape the ensuing chaos, Twilight in tow, or something? (aside from Twilight's given reason for not using magic being "beaten too badly" [which is obviously BS in my eyes, if she has a tenth of her strength]) You'd think committing murder, and seeing someone who's done so much for her being threatened would give her the emotions, the anger that would strengthen her magic, as it generally goes with ponies (plus, if she was doing work, she could've used the time they all spent talking to build up her strength, for an attack, while no one was looking at her, but alas, Talking is a Free Action).
...Or, Sunburst could be next to her, and this is rather poorly worded, on account of lacking "an orange stallion" or some such. Or it's both "her magic is unbound," and "Sunburst is next to her." Regardless, that is not well-written.
Wait, what "tree branch?" Where are you that you can see in, yet not be spotted?
Do something implausible?
(Again, stop worshipping the Goggles of Plot Convenience, they've failed you, what, twice, or more in detecting the enemy? By all rights you probably should've heard of scrying spells more impressive than that, or something)
And now for an infiltration... probably inspired by some movie/video game or whatever, but I digress. Has to be convenient somehow, right?
Edited to add: If I did more chapter reviews, it'd likely be on a more recent blog post.
5234766
Oy vey, that writing (the story, not your review of it).
And the Chinese killed Ember's father, Torch? How? The guy was the size of a small mountain! I question if anything less than an armored battalion could take him down without horrible losses.
5238178
That's just one of the many reasons why I'm offended by the Chinese lack of heavy weapons. In the Dragons chapter it's mentioned that the Chinese shot and killed Dragons with 5.56mm rifle (!!!) rounds, going right through their Dragonscales, which is highly-dubious: in the case of the larger Dragons, it's even more dubious that such light projectiles would do more than a few stray birdshot would do to a Human wearing body armor.
In the case of Torch, I agree with you that it would take medium to heavy artillery to seriously affect him. And probably multiple hits to his vitals, at that.
5238178
(Thanks for reading! I don't think I'd have thought you to be talking about my review automatically, unless you specified it; though I'm sure Jordan definitely has at least some advantages in how he covers it, due to him having knowledge in areas that I don't, and more than likely having more wisdom overall [I'm definitely younger].)
I can't claim to be an expert on how it'd go exactly, but I'd probably find it questionable if a freaking 120mm could bring a dragon that big down in one go, if it wasn't through some weak spot, let alone rifles, or mortars.
It'd be like easily killing freaking Tirek in his "fourth form" when he was tough enough to ram through a mountain, and survive everything Twilight threw at him, without being worse for wear, with an average rifle/small arms: it probably just doesn't make any sense.
And Torch is many, many times bigger than he is, and is covered in dragon scales that should make him significantly more durable than any living thing on the planet (including a manyfold advantage over elephants), and surely, that armor he has, that isn't overly easy for what, small arms to go through, right? (speaking of which, regarding a headcanon I've seen, it did make a neat argument for that to be a thing dragons to do, metalsmithing. A combination of the fruits of Mundane Utilities [being basically fireproof, ability to breath hot fire], and being long-lived, that headcanon; but I digress)
And as for what Torch could do, he could probably incinerate, what, at least a battalion, easily? I don't think I'd question his ability to throw multiple tanks around, either.
How do you cut the crap out of dragons without superhuman strength and absurdly strong and sharp knives? How are you supposed to do any real damage to them with batons?
It just doesn't make any sense. I wouldn't be surprised if they could all be singlehandedly taken out by Basil, that red dragon central to the plot from Dragonshy.
5238253
Birdshot isn't a great choice against humans to begin with anyway; it's in the name itself, with how diffused the energy is amongst the pellets (leading to shallow individual pellet penetration), and how bad they are at retaining energy as they travel.
Yeah, it can kill someone, yes, it can do so in one shot even, perhaps even instantly, but it's nowhere near ideal. Certainly terrible against cover where it should be "concealment."
...this is mostly off-topic, oops. What you said was correct, anyhow, I should note.
5238259
Yes, I know. Save at point-blank range, it has lousy penetration against even heavy clothing, let alone body armor.
That's why it's often used to fire warning shots.
5238445
Ah, good to hear. Unfortunately, there are some who uh... defend it rather vehemently (although, yes, there are factors of "shot size" and such, but it's often "#8" they speak of)
It certainly helps that if you fire it into the air, it's probably not causing anything other than "raining tiny pellets" on the way down.
As for the value that warning shots have, that's another (probably contentious) debate entirely.
5238722
Depends on the situation. A single warning shot will often see off a group of mischievous kids who one really doesn't want to shoot, but it might be less well advised against armed home invaders.
5238256
I agree with all of this. Heck, even more -- mundane? Less horribly powerful? Equestrian creatures ought to be incredibly dangerous when dealing with even a small group of normal humans. In some stories I've done (my 'Dragons of Pennsylvania' series) I have it that Equestrian critters are all stronger, tougher, and faster than humans of comparable size. Ponies can be dangerous if they bring their hooves and weight to bear, and then you have Dragons and Griffons who gave even more efficient built-in weapons. As well as a fine set of instincts on how to use them, and no qualms about doing so as some human thugs learn the hard way when they try mauling a full-grown Griffon.
5238253
Yeah. In my 'Dragons of Pennsylvania' stories here on the site, I have an assassination threat made against a visiting Princess Ember. It's taken seriously by her Secret Service detail (visiting head of state and all) because the person doing so includes a photograph of a Barrett M82 and its bullets to convince them that they're serious. I figure even 'small' dragons like Ember and Garble would need to be shot with an elephant gun to face actual danger.
Though I did have a 30' long or so 'instructor' named Volcano be slowed down with an eye full of bear mace. Hmm, maybe chemical weapons could be used against the dragons? Though if they can breathe the air around lava they must have a good set of lungs.
I mean, where is this vantage point that they can see everything? Are they in a tree further up the mountain (which would be possibly questionable if they could see beyond buildings involved)? Somewhere in front of the front gate? It's never explained, because the scenery wasn't described, like their location relative to the front gates. And if the former, why not teleport to an unguarded location, to infiltrate, after having Luster scope it out with binoculars, or something, waiting until it's clear if necessary?
How does that stop the dragons from actually managing to kill them? Why is it so easy to kill dragons with bullets in this setting? How many guards and/or soldiers are there so they can't just be overwhelmed by the slaves, because they're seemingly vastly outnumbered? Would tear gas actually do anything to stop a dragon from breathing fire, let alone instantly?
Could dragons get around/ease some of those effects with nictitating membranes? (which Spike was portrayed as having them once in canon)
Are the Chinese involved all wearing gas masks already (unlikely) or would at least some of them need to get some, to avoid them being affected as well?
5249146
I mean, actual bullets, why is it as easy as it is for real bullets to hurt them, in this setting? Why can they be apparently hurt by batons, if rubber bullets wouldn't work? Why would Lieutenant General Jin manage to hurt, let alone incapacitate Spike with his Elbow PadsTM, if that wouldn't work?
Even if you're being tear gassed, that doesn't inherently stop you from say, shooting guns. Would it actually stop the dragons from breathing fire, would they even have the tear gas deployed the nanosecond they tried to do anything, stop them from managing to kill one or more of them before it's one: deployed, and two: is breathed in? Also, dragons can swim in lava, with whatever noxious gases are around them, how would it be a given that tear gas would even work on their physiology? How do you know you wouldn't need a different chemical agent to do so, like something say, derived from the Dragonsneeze Tree, which doesn't affect ponies?
The question of "if they could launched it the nanosecond they tried to attack, could they stop them from killing any soldiers" is probably... "no, they're not that fast."
Finally... I ask again, how many soldiers are occupying the area? A platoon? How many slaves are they watching over in total? Technology can only do so much if you're severely outnumbered, in a lot of cases, especially if, as in this case, they have abilities far in excess of what humans possess; humans who had far less going for them managed escapes/rebellions well enough.
5249642
So they're astronomically outnumbered. There's supposed to be at least, what, thousands, tens of thousands of them, more even, and there's less than 50 of the Chinese to secure the area? That would mean they're outnumbered by a factor of hundreds. There's nothing plausible about that.
Even aside from how they shouldn't have managed to stage a takeover as portrayed (how do you take Discord down, capture him? Tangibility is optional for him, as is keeping a cohesive shape, the Chinese have no way of actually knowing about him until he makes his presence known, he doesn't believe in playing fair as per his own words, and he can defeat them all with a snap of his fingers, send them to another dimension, any number of things, if you don't drain his magic, or surprise him with powerful magic, which he'd probably notice them first, and humans do not have magic), they could literally do nothing more complex than rush them in waves, and still manage to kill them all, especially considering a lot of them of them are either physically comparable to humans, or outright better, more durable.
Aside from him, y'know, being a Lieutenant General, it not being in the job description, humans just aren't that ungodly strong. A mundane human shouldn't be able to physically outperform an alicorn that easily, whether it be in strength or durability; Celestia got back up from, didn't die from an attack that was destroying the stone of her castle like paper in canon, while Twilight was somehow on the ground after one kick to the chest here, when that shouldn't be able to even hurt her, and she could've furthermore done anything up to and including dodging via teleport, flying in place out of reach, not just standing by idly while he attacks her friends, not attacking, if he could even beat them (he shouldn't be able to beat the Mane Five [excluding Twilight], in a straight fight).
Again, he's somehow physically outperforming a dragon (Spike), who has not insignificant muscles (and can fly, failing physical superiority), to the point of a one hit incapacitation. If nothing about that screams "unbelievable," even with however much gym time and training he might have had, I don't know what to tell you, because that screams "he's superhuman" where no such authorial intent seems to exist.
Why can't they breathe fire? What actually stops them?
To bring something else up, regarding "how are they holding them," dragons can melt metal in canon. How large is the biggest dragon that they've enslaved? Dragons can either claw through whatever restraints you use on them (due to how sharp their claws are), or they can melt them off, or just bite them off, with it being a cooperative effort if need be.
You try to lock dragons up for the night, or whatever, and then you might find out that they've just melted their way out of the restraints and cell. And again, tear gas wouldn't be deployed in time to stop one random dragon from killing multiple guards singlehandedly, in that exact scenario, let alone multiple having the same idea.
That's not even getting into what the other races can do.
Batons are effective against humans, not beings with thick hides and scales that reinforce strong bone, so even saying it's possible to cripple them that way, it's not especially likely for them to be fatally wounded in such a fashion, as portrayed.
Also... let's think of the logistics of human(s) beating dragons with batons for a moment: even assuming they'd actually be hurting them, what's stopping them from twisting their body and head around to breathe fire at the ones who are trying to do that? And no, don't say "tear gas," because that doesn't stop the human(s) in question from being any less incinerated before it's too late. Are they being held down while that's happening? How many grown men would it take to physically restrain one resisting dragon, especially considering how variable they are in size? Think trying to physically subdue a bear with a baton, but worse, even if you had multiple people. Or am I supposed to believe they'd just let themselves be limply shackled, or whatever?
I'll consider going through the rest of it, dunno about Jordan. I'd suggest not making trying to make further edits on the story; it's better in some cases to let old mistakes stand, so you can learn from them, instead of awkwardly trying to patch them up.
5250298
No, that doesn't work. I don't think you'd be able to one-up Discord as a human with a taser; if it was as simple as electrocuting him to incapacitate him, you'd think a pegasus, unicorn, or alicorn (Celestia and/or Luna) would've defeated him in the backstory, with a lightning strike via cloud, or a magical shock spell, not the Elements of Harmony.
Aside from that, how did they get close enough to taze him? Did he just stand there, without say, turning the ground under them into soap so they'd slip trying to get in range? Or this?
He, being who he is, levitates himself off the ground, flies a good portion of the time, which he would probably do when humans (who can't fly) encounter him, carrying themselves in an obviously hostile manner, and it isn't outside the realm of plausibility that he'd know what humans are, and what their technology does, being a probable interdimensional traveler (how else would he know so much about pop culture, and he has opened a portal to another dimension before), therefore know they're probably hostile soldiers.
Discord also doesn't need to snap his fingers to use his magic. He doesn't snap his fingers every time he teleports (it's just for show/force of habit); even if he did require snapping, he can also snap with his tail, as demonstrated in Keep Calm and Flutter On. Even if the rings did stop him from using his distinct chaos magic, how do you know he couldn't just bite his hands off to get all of his powers back, if his sheer amounts of power didn't just overwhelm them after a certain amount of time? He didn't snap his fingers to do this. And his debut portrayed him as moving the sun and moon without snapping his fingers.
Which... by the by, who exactly is maintaining the day-night cycle in this story, since ponies control that too, last I checked? Is it permanently day, night, or... did you just not think about it?
You'd honestly be better off going "Discord went on a vacation to another world" or something, because defeating him without using magic against him is kind of a hard sell, typically.
No, actually, it isn't a game-changer, for the following reason: If the dragon is bigger than you are, heavier (as they likely are on average), there's no reason why they can't just send you to the ground. Riot shields don't help that much when you're physically outclassed in every way on multiple levels, unless you're gonna tell me you can effortlessly bring down a brown bear because you, and one other guy, have batons and large riot shields? How about if that bear was sapient, and was bigger, covered with scales?
Do you still not see the underlying problem?
What I'm trying to say is that a human isn't physically superior to Alicorns or strong Earth Ponies, because they're supernatural monsters by human standards of strength, as are dragons, and no amount of physical exercise will change that fact, along with how durable they ought to be.
They're humans who can't breathe fire, dragons aren't. That still doesn't prove "dragons can't breathe fire while being teargassed," assuming the same tear gas that affects humans or ponies would even work on dragons to begin with.
How do you know dragon scales don't conduct electricity in a way that it just flows into the ground, harmlessly, if they're semi-metallic or whatever? They're not humans. Also, how much R&D for the Shock Collars? Because dragons don't come in a small range of shapes and sizes, so you might need far more voltage to affect one, vs another, even assuming their scales conducted it in such a way it affected them. It wouldn't be an overly simple procedure to figure that out.
A couple of systematic problems with the entire story are, everyone got Worfed in favor of some Gary Stu human who 1, we don't care about automatically (it's an uphill battle to make the reader care about them, because they're an OC), 2, doesn't have his abilities properly justified (muscle memory of martial arts with different body mechanics carrying over post-transformation, among other things), 3, doesn't earn his power, having it handed to him on a silver platter basically (he was literally in Equestria less than three chapters and became an alicorn [and I'd unironically argue that say, Starlight Glimmer is astronomically more worthy of that, same for every last non-alicorn member of the Mane Six]), and 4, is an Instant Expert, having a better track record with using his powers, than native inhabitants who've actually studied and/or practiced magic in their lives before.
It also doesn't feel like humans are enslaving sapient beings that are physically superior to them in every way to them except for technology, it instead feels like humans are enslaving other humans wearing costumes that might have accessories like sharp claws, a flamethrower, or whatever.
The Equestrians in general, be they unicorns, pegasi, earth ponies, an alicorn, dragons, griffons, etc, don't come across as being physically superior in any way, when they should be, not to mention how allegedly smart characters are complete morons who couldn't negotiate their way out of a wet paper bag on a regular basis.
5250366
Discord could be overcome by someone very intelligent and cool and calculating who understood what he was and took advantage of his overconfidence. He is however physically more powerful than any non-superpowered Human, and almost inconceivably more magically-powerful than most mages of any normal species.
Once one captured Discord, one would need to contain him by means of something which will keep his magic suppressed. The slightest flaw in the containment system, and Discord will break out and do whatever he wills. Which probably won't be kind to oneself, especially if one abused Discord or his friends in the meantime. Particularly if one hurt the harmless-looking yellow-and-pink Pegasus.
One could try to kill Discord. The problem is that the physical Discord is basically a manifestation of Chaos, and as long as he retains his link to Chaos he can't be easily destroyed. In Show, Starlight Glimmer once vaporized his physical form, and this only banished him for a short while.
(By the way, stop and think about the fact that Starlight Glimmer, her ire roused, was perfectly willing and able to vaporize Discord. There's no evidence that she knew he would survive such treatment. Weak, fragile, easily-intimidated Ponies, indeed!)
Yes, exactly. We have in-Show seen Alicorns, and Earth Ponies of legendary strength such as Rockhoof and Applejack, perform feats of strength that are beyond the abilities of any real-world Humans or Horses. And a real-world Horse of the largest and strongest breeds is on the average far stronger than even a Human bodybuilder. Observe a Clydesdale or Percheron, for example.
Dragons have to be strong, kg for kg, or the large ones would not be able to move their own bodies (the Square-Cube Law). and we have seen in-Show that even a very small Dragon (like Spike during the main run of the Show) is as strong as a strong Pony (only an Alicorn or legendary-strength Earth Pony could compete with him). Great strength requires great durability or one's own muscles would tear one apart; Dragons must have something like titanium-steel reinforced bones and muscles and sinews made out of something stronger than Kevlar.
In addition to this general great strength and durability, Dragons have especially tough teeth and claws -- we've seen Spike in Show bite and claw his way through what appears to be hard rock and alloyed steel. Spike's Dragonbreath, even as a child, is hot enough to rapidly melt most metals.
This all adds up to a physically-formidable creature; one capable of easily destroying even larger real-world animals, let alone mere Humans. Someone like Spider-Man or The Thing could mix it up with a Dragon hand-to-hand; a non-powered Human, even one on the order of Doc Savage or Tarzan, would be well-advised to keep his head down.
5250370
Quite honestly, when I said: "bite his hands off to get his powers back," I had in mind an old comment on Derpibooru that Alara had, regarding Fall of Equestria (NSFW pic, so won't link it); basically it was like "when you're Discord, any physical mutilation ceases to matter the second you get your godlike powers back." (she said "bite hands off" too)
And yeah, Jin and the Chinese are not smart, like Opposition!Twilight Sparkle is. I'd put my money on that character successfully putting an end to an attempted attack on Equestria, as carried out here... ruthlessly, even aside from how Canon!Twilight herself should've probably been able to stop them herself (possibly even during S1).
...Anyway, to get back on Discord, overconfident as he may be, he wouldn't say, walk straight into a lopsided fight with nothing going for him. If you had say, four alicorns against him, he'd at least try "separate them," if he didn't just avoid them entirely, and it should be noted that every time he's lost, it's involved surprise, a rare (far as we can tell) kind of anti-magic artifact, powerful magic draining, or the EoH.
A Chinese Army waltzing into Equestria is probably not going to shock Discord. He'd more than likely notice them before they did him, and he'd act accordingly, and be no-nonsense in his approach if he had any reason to believe they could hurt him, and/or they did/tried something with Fluttershy; the S6 finale could've ended very abruptly, and I'd imagine going in guns blazing against his friends in a way they could die would be one of those cases. I'd imagine going after randoms would be enough to piss him off, or at least take it seriously, after The Last Problem timeskip.
(addressed Fluttershy above, so that's covered)
It's also worth noting that Discord is a highly talented manipulator, even if you take all of his magic away from him. One of his greatest weapons is his mouth, and he can easily trick you into being too complacent, acting in a stupid way, he might piss you off into trying to go into his cell and beat him, or he even might pretend to betray Equestria to China in a ruse.
Which... actually, come to think of it, to the Chinese, Discord's basically an Eastern Dragon, and that may or may not hold sway with some of them, if they're inclined to assign special significance to it. I dunno, tell me if I'm wrong.
Yep.
We can't forget just how hard she hit that Bugbear, sent it scurrying off (probably was a lesser one than the one Twilight and pals fought; they are a species, that one Twilight and her friends fought had escaped Tartarus). There's no indication she didn't kill those flash bees, and in any case, she was willing to collapse an avalanche on Chrysalis, which I'm pretty sure she wouldn't have minded if that took her down for good, with however much weight that was.
5250375
Yep; it's basically this trope, right?
And even tiny dragons can chomp gems apart, which... is quite a bit of pressure.
Pretty much.
Dragons aren't supposed to be this easily hurt, this much of a laughing stock, outside of a one-off joke or something. Dragons are supposed to be inherently tougher than humans could ever be, and they do not come across as such in this fic.
(I'd also like to point out that Starlight isn't wont to lose because she's overconfident. She's less likely to "play with her food" in a fight without reason, and therefore, is less likely to fall into a trap that Discord might. And even then, I don't think Discord would underestimate humans to the point of losing like that, unless they had a really good trump card, that would have to be really well planned out, calculated, which a taser... isn't, and it's questionable if you could even do anything to him without magic.)
(and regarding physical strength, Not The Hero said it very well)
(How much more would Discord's body weigh than a human's?)
5250439
You're looking at this whole thing backwards: the core problem is that the Chinese effortlessly took over Equestria as portrayed. I'm not saying it should be impossible for humans to conquer Equestria, but as portrayed, they did so without taking much, if any losses (and if losses happened, you've gotta go deeper than just the numbers, like "what do they mean for them, now that they lost X amount of people"). For all we know, Charlie was the first character, named or unnamed, to kill any Chinese in the story, in the wake of the invasion.
Characters are made into complete idiots so that they can take over, up to and including forgetting that they have magic when fights are happening, not to mention their physical advantages being glossed over, if applicable (the ability to fly not amounting to much of anything in fights, a strong Earth Pony like Applejack losing the way she did). All of that just so you can "justify" Charlie being needed to save them, have him be the Big Hero That Saves Everybody And Gets The Girl.
It isn't justified, it's just a blatant power fantasy lived out via Charlie, and not a well-done one at that
They're outnumbered, they don't have a home field advantage, they don't know the layout of the lands going in, their Lieutenant General "Metal Pads" Jin is a bloodthirsty idiot who decided storming the castle alone, then walking into a fucking seven on one alone, is a remotely good idea; the only reason he wasn't easily defeated and captured (or just killed) then and there being that the author protected him from suffering logical consequences, because you think the Mane Seven (Mane Six + Spike) being so easily defeated in a physical fight by someone physically inferior to at least five of them (Rainbow Dash, Twilight Sparkle, Pinkie Pie, Applejack, Spike, to say nothing of magical abilities, and their durability that isn't on the level of "go down in just one hit from a human") isn't complete bullshit. A non-sapient real life horse would've probably put up a better fight against Jin than those seven did in your story, no joke, which is beyond ridiculous.
Logically, at least a few Equestrians would've won skirmishes, and captured their technology, appropriated it, so unicorns at least (telekinesis), along with griffons (they have fingers), dragons (if their hands are small enough to use them) etc, might be using the Chinese's own guns against them (which is one of the reasons why say, destroying guns captured from defeated soldiers is stupid), as part of a guerrilla warfare campaign.
Aside from the aforementioned absurdities with the Mane Seven, it's highly unlikely the Chinese would say, just waltz right into the School of Friendship with riot shields, deploy tear gas, with Starlight and Sunburst being easily apprehended (along with whatever narrative Black Hole that Trixie fell into). In fact, it'd be more likely for her to outright get away, avoid capture, after incapacitating those who tried, or even killing them, while getting everyone to safety, in part because the Chinese don't know who she is, would think she's "just some principal" when well...
Starlight has powerful magic, has great reflexes, would generally not be stupid enough to just let you close in on her for physical attacks (riot shields won't save you from magic blasts, allow you to close in to incapacitate). Even if they quietly infiltrated the Castle in Ponyville (which they'd have no reason to do silently), where she presumably lives, you'd probably still not one-up her that easily.
And in any case there's a lot impractical about invading cities like say, Las Pegasus, or Cloudsdale (the latter of which is a mobile city, too), so why would I assume that they ever managed to do so? With the former and latter, they'd have to fly into the city, and they'd be unable to stand on the clouds, and good luck tracking even half of the pegasi down if things went to hell for them, because they can stay up in the clouds to evade capture while flying away, and they can go in different directions to spread them thin if they tried to chase them all down, which could also lead to consequences for the Chinese later if they escaped.
...
And no, "they'd think he's like, in a dragon costume" isn't what I was going for. I mean, if any of the Chinese would care about the underlying mythology behind Eastern Dragons, which could possibly affect their interactions with Discord. That might be an interesting thing to address in a story, if it's true that they'd care, depending on if they're superstitious.
Teamwork only gets you so far when you're their physical inferior by a large margin without advanced technology or magic to mitigate that (riot shields and batons aren't "advanced technology," it's a really basic thing in fact). Just imagine, if you will, trying to non-lethally subdue a human, approach them in a group of five, when they're firing a flamethrower at you constantly, and can move themself. Now imagine that they're bigger, stronger, fire hotter flames, and have claws. Do you have high confidence in your ability to subdue them? Do you think tear gas will stop them, even if it did anything to dragons to begin with? This is a problem that especially applies to before they were enslaved as well, because killing dragons, let alone capturing them alive isn't supposed to be a trivially easy task.
Especially given that it seems like, presumably because it's a magical element, sometimes dragons' fire breath can explode. (Also, do also note how strong she is for her size, or how heavy she is, with her cracking the ground upon landing; now imagine how physically strong Spike in The Last Problem might be, heavy, how hard trying to send him to the ground in one elbow strike would be)
5250771
Some random unicorns on unclouded or clouded ground in Las Pegasus (cloudwalking spells exist, if you'll recall) could literally just use telekinesis to pull or push them onto the clouded parts of the city, when they land to apprehend them (a painstaking process that would be), and they go bye-bye, or some pegasi could swoop in and do the same. There'd be next to nothing they could do to stop it, if they got blindsided, which could easily happen if they could swoop in from above, behind, the sides, and in front of you, because it's not like a turn-based game.
How many helicopters do they have at their disposal in the course of chasing them down, killing them all, the tens of thousands of them or more, spreading out as they'd likely do, systematically? They realistically wouldn't be able to get them all, maybe not even most of them, whether it be because they flew into a forest, hid away? Are attack helicopters generally suited for attacking airborne targets like flying ponies, or ground targets? They're suited for the latter.
Also, the helicopters have to land at some point, refuel, and how many places are safe to do that from? Are the airbases, improvised or not, safe from attack, sabotage? Is there anything stopping pegasi from flooding their bases with severe storms?
How are the numbers of troops allocated in the course of balancing defense and offense? How aren't they spread thin in doing all of this? Equestria isn't a small place, nor are the surrounding lands, so they're not occupying it properly, they're attacking places and not holding them down for the most part, a most unwise strategy.
For the last time: he shouldn't be able to even scratch those two, no matter how much training he does, because he's ONLY HUMAN. And you're ignoring the facts that even if the first 5 listed only come up to about his waist, they can still fly faster than he can run regarding the Pegasi (Rainbow Dash to the point that you cannot react in time), Fluttershy has the Stare, Pinkie Pie can break the laws of physics and is super strong, and Rarity has magic too, also has the telekinetic precision to use needles on weak spots, or hurt him with magic, as well, even if she might have to aim for the less armored limbs to hurt him with raw power.
And they wouldn't be oh-so-chivalrous to the point of attacking him one or two at a time, in single-file lines. They'd have all attacked him after he hit Spike, especially Twilight.
But since Jin is just so much better than they are, he gets to beat all of them without taking a scratch, and Twilight doesn't even try to attack him, and Luster Dawn just sits there and does nothing with her magic.
His armor doesn't even matter when he never gets a blow landed on him, never is described as having it save him, in the Prologue.
Your "calculation" doesn't take into account the fact that Twilight's magic is much more powerful than any rifle cartridge, any small arm, or how merely being thrown around bodily with magic can kill you, which Twilight is more than capable of doing. What stops Twilight from casting a freezing spell on him? He doesn't have magic to mitigate that, and he isn't disproportionately strong, and it's one human vs over ten ponies (in the linked instance), so I could stop there... but I won't.
Regarding force, Twilight managed to cause someone who had a shovel shatter against his leg, was supernaturally durable to fall to the ground, sans a tooth. Tirek weighs a lot more than a ton. And I say "supernaturally durable" because Star Swirl's magic isn't a joke, and Tirek didn't get hurt by it.
Jin has ABSOLUTELY NOTHING of the sort going for him, and would get seriously hurt or die, the same as any other human subjected to sudden acceleration and deceleration (it's not the fall that kills you, it's the sudden deceleration, same goes for the case of sudden acceleration, like if say someone gets hit by a truck). She's sent changelings flying with magic on different occasions, she's blown up crystals, among a multitude of other things that make me go "no, you couldn't stop that with mundane body armor, of any kind, as an ordinary human." If it was being remotely realistic based off what we can gleam from canon, it would look like this, Jin dead instantly. Even if the body armor magically did stop it from piercing his body, it wouldn't stop Twilight from breaking every other bone in his body, from the blunt force trauma of such a thing.
Regarding if Twilight's just playing Defense, without attacking, how would Jin get past her doing this? Nothing he could physically throw at it would bring it down.
All of the above, by the way, is from back when Twilight should be less powerful than she is in this story. Alicorns probably grow stronger overall as they reach their prime.
You're vastly overestimating how much good they'd do against magic, especially the top 1-10% users (or even an average magic user; nothing, far as we could tell would have stopped a unicorn from trying to snatch guns out of their hands from a distance, turning it against them, during the initial invasion), or against those with super strength, or I dunno, lightning strikes? And there's the important caveat that the Chinese are trying to typically use non-lethal force against those who aren't bound to try to do so as a first resort, due to their retarded Lieutenant General.
They wouldn't have had any suppressor rings on them at the start of the story, during the initial invasion, so hmm... I think they'd have died trying with rubber bullets, and they can stop regular bullets, for those that can do proper shields, in all likelihood.
Stop Wikidumping me. You didn't do your due diligence in researching military tactics, and it shows in the story, and in general. You're not going to convince me into thinking you know what you're talking about by copying and pasting verbatim from Wikipedia, let alone that you have in-depth knowledge on the matter.
You don't think about the logistics of dealing with sapient beings that necessitate such heavy arms, how many might realistically die in the process of bringing them down. Did they just magically know to find and attack Torch, first thing? Because it'd be more likely that he's asleep somewhere or something, and Ember seeks him out and says something like "help, they're attacking our lands, please help us deal with them, Father," so from a realistic standpoint (not to mention a more interesting storytelling one), they might have to do more work in lining up the kill shots, end up with a good number of them dead before he's brought down, if it even happens.
5250375
This all adds up to a physically-formidable creature; one capable of easily destroying even larger real-world animals, let alone mere Humans. Someone like Spider-Man or The Thing could mix it up with a Dragon hand-to-hand; a non-powered Human, even one on the order of Doc Savage or Tarzan, would be well-advised to keep his head down.
This is so OT but now I want to see someone write a scene where one of those characters (Doc or Tarzan) has to fight an Equestrian dragon, and wins, in a way that actually works. I mean, Doc is a genius and usually has a hidden arsenal on him. And Tarzan is a physical superman (not superhuman but as close as a 'mundane' human can get). And he's smart, and ruthless when it's his neck on the line. One stellar example of that is in Walt Simonson's Tarzan versus Predator at the Earth's Core, which is everything the title suggests. Tarzan takes down several of the Predator aliens in one on one fighting and by using every part of the environent to his advantage.
5250416
And they have no physical advantages over me whatsoever. They are shorter, they are weaker, they have no tail, they can't fly, no skin protection anywhere, their hands are as good as mine but have no claws on them, neither their legs nor their feet are as strong as mine, and while they are omnivores they have a lot fewer meat-eater teeth than I do. They have some advantages over ponies, hands and height, although ponies have magic so I think humans do worse on that deal as well. They're much more aggressive than ponies, but that just makes them more fun to taunt than they'd otherwise be, considering how weak they are.
May I please know where this was originally written, hopefully with a link?
5250913
Sure thing!
To be specific, the story I'm quoting is "Not The Hero," and the quote comes up in the second chapter of the story, so you don't have to get very far to see it.
The story mocks 7th Element of Harmony stories, and Gary Stus in general (with some aspects it's mocking you can see reflected in this story, with characters being unreasonably dumb/nerfed, in favor of the human, and such, even if it started years prior), as a plot point, and it's not really much of a comedy, since it takes itself seriously.
5250945
Thanks! I'll take a look at it.
5250913
Oh yes, after I wrote that I thought to myself "How would Doc Savage or Tarzan handle Equestrian Dragons?" and I concluded "With brains, skills and speed."
An important part of "brains" is that they would recognize that they were fighting creatures far too tough to handle bare-handed, or even with hunting knives -- they would require tactics and perhaps special equipment. Doc would analyze their weaknesses and contrive a special weapon to take advantage of them; Tarzan would set traps to trip them up allowing him to strike while they were distracted.
Both of them would use terrain and stealth to their advantage, and try to split up their foes so that they never had to take on more than one at a time.
In short, the opposite of what Jin does.
5250982
Not the Hero is great. Harsh in places, but great.
5250998
Now that would be fun to read.
There's also playing on the dragons' psychology, using trickery and deception (the classic 'weak human versus superhuman monster' tactic).
I found the other article that got copied and pasted from on their part.
That was copied verbatim as well.
(Not that I'm surprised, they literally did the same thing in the story, like when it came to Charlie describing Sydney, Australia, to Luster Dawn. If I had any advice for anyone who's an aspiring writer, you should probably never do that, especially if it doesn't feel natural to read as presented, especially if it's in dialogue. At least learn to paraphrase it so you might go "hmm, an actual person could talk something like that.")
5236143
Remember Friendship Is Magic, the very first episode of the Show? The one that everyone has watched? Twilight was using combat teleportation tricks on Nightmare Moon when Twi was just a Unicorn schoolgirl!
Teleportation is Twilight's signature spell, one of her oldest and best-practiced. By the time of "The Last Problem" she'd be amazingly good at it, probably better at it than almost any other Pony.
Importantly, killing a totally-uninvolved slave changes the calculations on the part of the prisoners -- namely, that non-resistance does not mean relative safety. This increases the likelihood of an uprising.