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Oliver


Let R = { x | x ∉ x }, then R ∈ R ⟺ R ∉ R... or is it?

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May
13th
2017

Points of Canon: S7x08 - Hard to Say Anything · 6:53pm May 13th, 2017

Moving on.

Anyway, you have been warned appropriately.

So, Big Mac sure gets around. Cherilee, Marble Pie, and now Sugar Belle. Quick, someone set him up with Lemon Hearts. The heartbreak will be glorious. Anyway…

  • Rarity found “old costumes from the talent show,” which should be The Show Stoppers, in theory. Only, the rainbow wig, the pirate hat and the nose glasses don’t turn up in that episode at all. Was there another talent show we haven’t seen?
  • 1. This doesn’t bode well for the fate of Equestria’s Earth. It might get downgraded to an asteroid if it keeps shrinking like that.

    Big Mac is making a delivery to Starlight’s Village again. Without using a train. It’s like after the first visit to that village in The Cutie Map, a permanent portal of some kind has been established that goes straight there. Even though Mac agrees that’s “an awful long way for a pony to go,” that sort of trip should take multiple days – on hoof, with a loaded cart! – but mysteriously doesn’t.1 Apple Bloom states it’s his fifth trip this week. What’s going on here?…

  • I can’t parse the three simultaneous cries of the CMC, so I’ll leave that to people with better ears.
  • 2. As opposed to spy reality, which should, in theory, be covered by Bon-Bon…

    Scootaloo cooks up a James Bond movie script, about Big Mac being a spy out on a mission to thwart an evil villain with an “apple cannon.” You’d think Mac would be more likely to be a villain with an apple cannon… Before, the only clear cut case of spy fiction2 in primary canon were Pinkie’s stories in MMMystery on the Friendship Express, but if Scootaloo can spout stuff like that, spy thrillers are a thing. Further, Scootaloo is under the impression that spies “solve cases.”

  • Sweetie Belle is mysteriously able to read her book of fairytales while covered by the tarpaulin, but without using her horn for light. And the aura color on the book is wrong…
  • Right next to where Big Mac parked the cart, we can see the previously never seen bonsai apple tree. With full-size apples. Unpicked. (?) It remains there conspicuously for the entire episode.
  • The CMC have never been to Our Town before and don’t recognize any of the residents. Apple Bloom only knows of Sugar Belle from Applejack.
  • The pile of apples in the bakery contains about two carts worth. She sure goes fast through those apples.
  • According to Apple Bloom, this is his “very first crush.” All that blushing at Marble either wasn’t one, or Apple Bloom never noticed it, or someone took Pinkie’s idea about being related in seven generations back too seriously. Scootaloo mentions Cherilee, but nobody even mentions Marble.
  • Feather Bangs was “writing poetry by the pond.” Where’s the pond?…
  • Starlight’s cottage has been torn down and replaced with a tree, and I didn’t notice this in To Where and Back Again. Here, the tree is likewise present. All of you who were hoping she gets shuffled off to be the mayor of Our Town are not getting your wish.
  • The dialogue between Sweetie and Scootaloo, “When I was younger, I read all the fairytales…” / “When you were younger, huh?” suggests this episode wants to be set after Forever Filly, but does not by itself make it a hard lock.
  • Ponies do have fairytales wherein damsels need to be rescued from dragons. Sweetie Belle even says, “The knight in shining armor always gets the girl.” The usual question of what exactly dragons want to do with damsels remains entirely unexplained, and even weirder, because the local dragons seem to primarily eat gems.
  • And the first plan the CMC cook up is a bag snatching robbery. Covering it with “pretend to take” does not cut it, but Big Mac agrees anyway. No commentary. :)
  • Notice that this is only possible if the saddlebags are not normally securely fastened and just hang across the barrel.
  • Sugar Belle is napping in a hammock. We don’t see these often.
  • The next fairytale they plan to try is some variation on Sleeping Beauty, without the obvious prerequisites, like magical sleep. Notably, the ponies in the illustration are the same ones as in the previous illustration of the fight with a dragon over a damsel, suggesting they’re part of the same fairytale. Actually, every illustration in the book involves the same couple.
  • Much more notably, the background of the illustration contains an image of a crescent moon. This is the only admission that the Moon has any kind of phases in the primary canon.
  • “They rode off into the sunset,” says Sweetie Belle, although, they weren’t actually riding anyone on that picture. Interesting word usage.
  • The fact that Sugar Belle always remains entirely oblivious to how Feather Bangs pushes Big Mac away is in itself notable. Might be a cutie mark effect – his cutie mark is a feather between two hearts. This is probably also involved in the battle-of-the-bands effects as well. Only a pie in the face snaps Sugar Belle out of it. Have they actually given us a pony with a mind-affective cutie mark?…
  • One of the Feather Bangs groupies holds up a sign depicting an eye, a heart, and an upside-down horseshoe. I’m pretty sure this works only in English Equish. :)
  • “Like an angel on a candy cane.” So what does the word “angel” mean for ponies? ;)
  • Big Mac uses a banjo during his song. I don’t think I saw those in primary canon before.
  • Pinkie is not alone in treating boulders that should be embedded in the ground as if they have a flat surface level with the ground and rest on it – Sweetie Belle does this too. Is this a sign of developing party pony powers?…
  • When Scootaloo says “I’m new in town, mind showing me around?” Sugar Belle replies with pointing and saying, “Sure, that’s the whole town. It’s just the one street,” so at least we definitely know no other cottages exist.
  • For an out of the way village, Our Town surely has a lot of imported exotic fruit.
  • Sugar Belle has a very interesting cash register. I do think this came up before, though.
  • How exactly did Feather Bangs manage to get this cutie mark of his while not being actually able to talk to a mare?…

And thus they shipped Big Mac off, without even a kiss.


No new squares this time.

Chronology: Starlight or Twilicorn or the Friendship Castle are not in evidence. Our Town is. Starlight is mentioned indirectly as a friendly entity, which is not very solid, but irrelevant, because we have a new marker that we previously did not notice: Starlight’s cottage has been replaced with a tree sometime after the montage in The Cutie Re-Mark.

Chronology project has been updated accordingly, because I always do that.

Comments ( 48 )

Big Mac uses a banjo during his song. I don’t think I saw those in primary canon before.

AJ plays one during Apple Bloom's verse of "Apples to the Core" (while Granny plays the washboard.) The Apples seem to be a quite musical family, considering we've seen AJ with at least a fiddle as well, and I want to say a guitar at some point?

(ETA: Yeah, the fiddle was in the photos from A Canterlot Wedding, and the guitar was accompanying Coloratura in the camp flashback.)

>> 4531219

I think that was an ukulele rather than a guitar. However, it did sound as if it were a lot bigger.

P.S. “Of course I can sing, I’m a pony!” :)

The usual question of what exactly dragons want to do with damsels remains entirely unexplained, and even weirder, because the local dragons seem to primarily eat gems.

I mean, we've already witnessed multiple instances of ponies being racist/not knowledgable about/fearful of any races other than ponies so it's probably more of a creative liberties thing by fairytale writers than any kind of weird implications.

4531305

I mean, we’ve already witnessed multiple instances of ponies being racist/not knowledgable about/fearful of any races other than ponies so it’s probably more of a creative liberties thing by fairytale writers than any kind of weird implications.

Possible. Canterlot Museum has a diorama of pony knights fighting a dragon, though, and the era in which this supposedly happened dates to somewhere between one and two thousands of years ago, see the From The Shadows storyline. It never says why exactly were they fighting.

Much more notably, the background of the illustration contains an image of a crescent moon. This is the only admission that the Moon has any kind of phases in the primary canon.

Does Luna's cutie mark not count?

“Like an angel on a candy cane.” So what does the word “angel” mean for ponies? ;)

Well, it definitely means something. Between Angel Bunny and Angel Wings, one of the recruits in "Top Bolt," it's been thrown about a few times. There's also Pinkie's shoulder Rarity from "The Saddle Row Review," but it's unclear if her appearance was based more on Equestrian beliefs or morality tropes.

As for Feather Bangs, between him and Zephyr Breeze, I suspect that a feather in one's cutie mark can indicate false confidence or putting on a facade. (A "magic feather" effect?) Of course, how one could get a special talent in such a thing is beyond me. I also wonder what brought Feather Bangs to Our Town in the first place, and if it was before or after Starlight was deposed.

As a dispassionate and serious canon observer, I am in no way heartbroken at all the dashed ships this episode creates. Not at all.

At least the CMC were liquid adorableness this week.

Only, the rainbow wig, the pirate hat and the nose glasses don’t turn up in that episode at all. Was there another talent show we haven’t seen?

Interestingly, the rainbow wig seems to be from Mayor Mare at Nightmare Night, the Pirate Hat from Applejack's seaside voyage, and the disguise glasses were from Pinkie Pie spying on someone sometime. Doylist/Watsonian combo: The animators take excess art assets they don't plan to use again and give them to Rarity, who dumps the ugly ones on Sweetie Bell and calls them talent show costumes.

Big Mac is making a delivery to Starlight’s Village again. Without using a train. It’s like after the first visit to that village in The Cutie Map, a permanent portal of some kind has been established that goes straight there. Even though Mac agrees that’s “an awful long way for a pony to go,” that sort of trip should take multiple days – on hoof, with a loaded cart! – but mysteriously doesn’t.⁽¹⁾ Apple Bloom states it’s his fifth trip this week. What’s going on here?…

Two possibilities: Big Mac does take a train, he just loads the cart up on the train. Other possibility: As a small horse Big Mac could gallop 25 miles an hour at top speed. If you say earth pony magic means he can do that all day without keeling over, he could get up early in the morning, gallop for 8 hours (building up speed after he leaves town), delivery the apples and flirt with Sugar Belle for an hour, then run back home and go straight to bed.
...but probably the first explanation.

Scootaloo cooks up a James Bond movie script, about Big Mac being a spy out on a mission to thwart an evil villain with an “apple cannon.”

I think Big Mac is going to use an apple cannon to thwart the evil villain.

Before, the only clear cut case of spy fiction⁽²⁾ in primary canon were Pinkie’s stories in MMMystery on the Friendship Express, but if Scootaloo can spout stuff like that, spy thrillers are a thing.

So pissed Bon Bon wasn't in the background at that second.

Right next to where Big Mac parked the cart, we can see the previously never seen bonsai apple tree. With full-size apples. Unpicked. (?) It remains there conspicuously for the entire episode.

Probably another earth pony magic contest, like showing off a fruit the size of a volkswagen.

The pile of apples in the bakery contains about two carts worth. She sure goes fast through those apples.

I think the idea is she doesn't really use them, she's just ordering more to see more of Big Mac.

According to Apple Bloom, this is his “very first crush.” All that blushing at Marble either wasn’t one, or Apple Bloom never noticed it, or someone took Pinkie’s idea about being related in seven generations back too seriously. Scootaloo mentions Cherilee, but nobody even mentions Marble.

I'll assume the shy older brother doesn't report all these details to Apple Bloom, who needed this stuff pointed out to her in the first place. This scene still broke the heart.....of all those silly shippers. :raritycry:

All of you who were hoping she gets shuffled off to be the mayor of Our Town are not getting your wish.

Is there anyone else besides me who wanted this? Man, this episode is kicking me in the teeth. The only thing worse would be seeing Sunset Shimmer return to Equestria as a unicorn.

Ponies do have fairytales wherein damsels need to be rescued from dragons. Sweetie Belle even says, “The knight in shining armor always gets the girl.

A lot of this episode really kind of reinforces traditional gender roles (for American audiences), at least in the area of romance. I guess this kills the idea that mares always ask stallions out, etc.

The usual question of what exactly dragons want to do with damsels remains entirely unexplained, and even weirder, because the local dragons seem to primarily eat gems.

The damsel is a unicorn, perhaps the idea is she will be forced to hunt for gems like Rarity was?

Notice that this is only possible if the saddlebags are not normally securely fastened and just hang across the barrel.

Keep in mind that they are not exactly well made in Our Town. Also notice in the background the fashion shop has a ton of inventory sitting outside for some reason. Speaking of Our Town, have they still not come up with a proper name for it? Seems like a missed opportunity.

Much more notably, the background of the illustration contains an image of a crescent moon.

Could be that this story is from pre-Alicorn days, and the unicorns moved the sun and moon in a different rotation that caused crescent moons.

Have they actually given us a pony with a mind-affective cutie mark?…

I hope not. Ponies can be very oblivious at times. It may be that from Sugar Belle's perspective, Feather is a much smaller pony trying to squeeze by a much larger pony to talk to her as well.

For an out of the way village, Our Town surely has a lot of imported exotic fruit.

I think the diversity of plants and animals everywhere is taking us from "earth pony magic means all crops grow easily everywhere" to "tiny Equestria and its artificial environment mean all biomes are kind of smushed together."

How exactly did Feather Bangs manage to get this cutie mark of his while not being actually able to talk to a mare?…

He's very good at making gestures at a pony, just not sealing the deal. It also makes me wonder if the whole reason Feather Bangs was pursuing Sugar Belle was because she wasn't really as interested in him as other mares, and if he would have gotten cold feet if she'd chosen him.

I really loved the ending with Feather Bangs. Instead of making him a jerk, the girls try and set him up with the girls who actually like him. Now they're romance counselors as well!

To bad you already filled in OC last week, Feather Bangs is an obvious Justin Bieber copy.

4531338

Does Luna’s cutie mark not count?

That’s only an admission that Luna has phases… :)

I also wonder what brought Feather Bangs to Our Town in the first place, and if it was before or after Starlight was deposed.

Seeing as how he has this boy-band-attractiveness as his primary ability and yet can’t talk to a mare, I suspect whether it was before or after she was deposed, it was the promise of being rid of this mark that got him to seek the town.

4531345

Doylist/Watsonian combo: The animators take excess art assets they don’t plan to use again and give them to Rarity, who dumps the ugly ones on Sweetie Bell and calls them talent show costumes.

Of course Rarity has to be in cahoots with the animators, she does half the work for them…

Big Mac does take a train, he just loads the cart up on the train.

The CMC would probably be discovered early if that was so, though. Also, Trixie makes the same trip with her wagon, somehow… We’ve never seen a platform train. Maybe we should assume they exist.

As a small horse Big Mac could gallop 25 miles an hour at top speed. If you say earth pony magic means he can do that all day without keeling over, he could get up early in the morning, gallop for 8 hours (building up speed after he leaves town), delivery the apples and flirt with Sugar Belle for an hour, then run back home and go straight to bed.

Well, Trixie is not an earth pony, but at least, with her we don’t know how long the trip took and there’s no question where they would sleep, because that’s what the wagon is for…

I guess this kills the idea that mares always ask stallions out, etc.

That too, but I doubt there was a lot of that left standing by this point.

The damsel is a unicorn, perhaps the idea is she will be forced to hunt for gems like Rarity was?

Plausible and an interesting idea.

Speaking of Our Town, have they still not come up with a proper name for it? Seems like a missed opportunity.

Nope. “Starlight’s village” is on the official map, “Our Town” is the development name, ponies seem to use “Starlight’s old village,” no official in-universe name on record.

The Twelve Cottages?

Could be that this story is from pre-Alicorn days, and the unicorns moved the sun and moon in a different rotation that caused crescent moons.

Possible. They always use the same full moon sprite in modern day, though…

I really loved the ending with Feather Bangs. Instead of making him a jerk, the girls try and set him up with the girls who actually like him. Now they’re romance counselors as well!

I’d love to see his cutie mark story, actually. If there was an episode between him and CMC, I probably would. But alas.

4531380

The CMC would probably be discovered early if that was so, though.

Which is why I'm guessing this train just lets you roll your cart up onto it and park it there, like a car ferry. The smartest/safest design? No, but that's the best explanation I got.

Nope. “Starlight’s village” is on the official map, “Our Town” is the development name, ponies seem to use “Starlight’s old village,” no official in-universe name on record.

I get that ex-cultists got rid of her house, but they have to want her back if they still call it "Starlight's Village," right?

Possible. They always use the same full moon sprite in modern day, though…

Celestia and Luna just kind of rotate the sun 180* around the Equator before bringing it up again, for some reason.

I’d love to see his cutie mark story, actually. If there was an episode between him and CMC, I probably would. But alas.

I feel like the fandom is going to eat Feather Bangs alive once this episode airs in the US. He's like a combination of Flash Sentry and Zephyr Breeze. Shame, I would also enjoy that episode. Another thing to note: All three of the CMC get cute little hearts in their eyes when talking about romance, suggesting they are at least interested in the concept. (Also that Spike is a non-threatening joke, because not enough ships have been sunk in the last half-hour).

Yeesh. Not a fan of this episode. Not even because of the ship-sinking or anything. I don't actually care all that much about that. This one just made me cringe a lot. I cringed more at this than I did at Newbie Dash and Equestria Games combined. I don't think that's necessarily indicative of bad writing or anything, but it hampered my enjoyment for certain.

All of you who were hoping she gets shuffled off to be the mayor of Our Town are not getting your wish.

i0.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/facebook/001/126/626/e91.jpg

4531441

This one just made me cringe a lot.

Exactly my reaction, actually. I can’t fault the episode for it, but it’s not for me.

Feather Bangs' cutie mark is most likely in something like being hot. That's seriously it, he's just sexually desirable on a genetic, subconscious level, and because he was able to coast on that in the age ranges where romance didn't really matter, he's never actually learned how to talk to girls. He just copies the same gestures he's seen in fairy tales, but takes advantage of the fact that he was forced into a marriage with a terminally ill heiress just in time to inherit all her money to supersize the romantic gestures.

Have I headcanoned hard enough?

“Like an angel on a candy cane.” So what does the word “angel” mean for ponies? ;)

That could just be a ridiculous metaphor in-universe. Considering that Feather's song also features such brilliant lyrics as: "'Cause you are the sun / Painting my heart in the sky," "Feel my heart a-beating like / The rain upon a bumblebee," and "My love is burning hot like a cheese fondue!"

“They rode off into the sunset,” says Sweetie Belle, although, they weren’t actually riding anyone on that picture. Interesting word usage.

This has been an issue since the beginning. "Bridle Gossip" has somepony mention that "Zecora came riding into town."

My suggestion: It's a linguistic artifact. "Ride" was once a synonym for "walk," and over time came to mean something else in different contexts. A real-life example would be the word "let," which once was a synonym of "hinder," but now means just the opposite. "Let" retains its original meaning only in legalese, where it is often phrased as "without let or hindrance."

To get to our town. The flat bed car train ride is plausible. Or they disassembled Our Town and rebuilt, minus Starlight's cottage, closer to Ponyville.

Dragons need damsels in distress. Either like Rarity to find them gems or to ransom them off for all that gold they sleep on. Or kinky shenanigans. All of the above?

Feather Bangs was so annoying. All I could think when he showed up, shallow player trying to get the girl, only to dump her after his conquest. The end though there with the CMC, first thought was, herd?! Seriously need more poly/herd relationship representation.

Overall it was rather amusing. Yet I agree with those above, so much cringe.

Edit: After seeing some comments on Derpibooru. This was a Beauty & the Beast parody. Sugar Belle was only picked to be Big Mac's crush due to her name. Feather is that cad Gaston and the fan girls are the blondes.

4531716

Feather Bangs’ cutie mark is most likely in something like being hot. That’s seriously it, he’s just sexually desirable on a genetic, subconscious level, and because he was able to coast on that in the age ranges where romance didn’t really matter, he’s never actually learned how to talk to girls.

That would mean subscribing to the view that the mark is destiny, and will appear and remain the same no matter what the pony does or how they behave. So crusading for cutie marks is absolutely pointless, and getting a mark that is incompatible with life is actually likely.

I’m pretty sure that view is not canon compatible.

4531773

That could just be a ridiculous metaphor in-universe.

I mean more the word itself. Angels would be messengers of a deity. :)

4531815

Only, sometimes they use "ride" in more normal contexts, like riding a train...

4531826

Or they disassembled Our Town and rebuilt, minus Starlight’s cottage, closer to Ponyville.

They could have done a prettier job of it. :)

Either like Rarity to find them gems or to ransom them off for all that gold they sleep on.

Ransom is actually another possibility we don’t see often.

Seriously need more poly/herd relationship representation.

You mean any? Because there’s no sign of such things in canon and even here the CMC wonder if more than one special somepony is even possible…

4531936 Fair enough. It was merely a silly idea.

4531936

I mean more the word itself. Angels would be messengers of a deity. :)

Yes. But considering how many of Feather's song lyrics sound nice, but don't stand up to any sort of scrutiny, we can't draw any strong conclusions from here about the meaning of "angel" in Equish. We can say that comparing a mare to an angel is a compliment that can have romantic connotations in some contexts, and that's about it.

4531338

As for Feather Bangs, between him and Zephyr Breeze, I suspect that a feather in one's cutie mark can indicate false confidence or putting on a facade. (A "magic feather" effect?)

I wonder what this implies about Night Glider, whose CM is a crescent moon flanked by two feathers.

4531826

Edit: After seeing some comments on Derpibooru. This was a Beauty & the Beast parody. Sugar Belle was only picked to be Big Mac’s crush due to her name. Feather is that cad Gaston and the fan girls are the blondes.

Ha, it fits.

Shippers relax, everyone will forget about Big Mac having anything steady by the next season.

4532023
Or Featherweight, for that matter. This is what happens when you try to derive a trend from two data points. :twilightsheepish:

4531936

Only, sometimes they use "ride" in more normal contexts, like riding a train...

Well, sure. There are plenty of words that mean different things, depending on context. Just look at all the definitions of "set."

Seriously need more poly/herd relationship representation.

You mean any? Because there’s no sign of such things in canon and even here the CMC wonder if more than one special somepony is even possible…

Way back in "Hearts and Hooves Day," the CMC, having done some research, note that "All the good [stallions] are taken." To my mind, that's always settled the matter.

Shippers relax, everyone will forget about Big Mac having anything steady by the next season.

Even so, poor Marble will be forever a pone. :trollestia:

4532128

Well, sure. There are plenty of words that mean different things, depending on context. Just look at all the definitions of “set.”

You mean the set of all sets? :pinkiehappy:

Even so, poor Marble will be forever a pone. :trollestia:

Just like most other characters. :)

At no point does Sweetie Belle comment on the similarity between her name and that of Sugar Belle. This suggests one of:

1. They've had that conversation already, presumably because the Apple family already know who he's delivering to. I can imagine Applejack smirking quietly as she says, "So, 'nother delivery tomorrow, Mac?"
2. The name pattern is common enough not to be noteworthy. Do we know any other ponies named "~ Belle"? In canon, that is, so not including eg Pinkie Belle / Silver Belle from Fallout Equestria.
3. She hasn't noticed. I know the CMC are as thick as a whale omelette, but are they that thick?

4532227

At no point does Sweetie Belle comment on the similarity between her name and that of Sugar Belle.

Sharing name components has so far only been conclusively observed in earth pony clans. Rainbow Dash shares no components with her parents at all, Twilight only shares one with her mother but Shining Armor doesn’t, etc, etc, etc. Despite Rainbow addressing Fluttershy’s parents as “Shy,” even if they are named that, which I doubt, “Zephyr Breeze” is not “Zephyr Breeze Shy.”

Even among earth ponies sharing a name component with your parents is not an overwhelming norm – most Apples do not, they have a theme naming going instead, and get apple-related names.

So it’s most likely that Sweetie Belle just doesn’t think of sharing a name component with a stranger as particularly noteworthy: to her, it carries no special meaning other than “what a coincidence.”

4532252
I wasn't thinking of "OMGee we might be related" so much as "Wait, your brother's dating somepony with almost exactly the same name as me? That's..."

4532265

…Flattering? :pinkiehappy:

Theory: Equestrian geography is emotional rather than physical. With more connections between ponies in town A and town B, the shortest possible distance between those two towns is reduced. There might even be a social-connections equation that can be derived based on the number of pony relationships between any two given towns, which expands or contracts the time it takes to travel between them. The absolute number of ponies in two anchor-towns may also be a factor. Because Starlight's Old Village is so small, it is easily drawn closer to larger towns like Ponyville.

This is why Canterlot seems to grow closer to Ponyville as time goes on, as well as the rapidity with which Manehattan turns from 'city on the other side of the continent' to 'day-trip'.

Equestria is tiny! I'm recalling the episode where a pony at the Canterlot rodeo grounds points toward the southern desert... and it's actually visible.

As for a crescent moon, I don't ever recall seeing one in the sky, but there have been several on banners and tapestries. Oh yeah, and a big glowing one over the Castle of the Two Sisters in the alternate timeline. I think that is a decoration on the topmost spire, but it might be the actual moon, strategically placed.

4532420

Equestria is tiny! I’m recalling the episode where a pony at the Canterlot rodeo grounds points toward the southern desert… and it’s actually visible.

But the tinier it gets, the more curved the surface has to be. :)

4532436
The planet doesn't have to be tiny, just the kingdom. I'm thinking it must be about 1.34 Rhode Islands, based on all available evidence.

4532467

The planet doesn’t have to be tiny, just the kingdom.

It does, for it to have temperate, tropical and permafrost zones within the borders of the country.

4532472
Naw. It's magic, man! Don't forget there's a jungle temple somewhere in the woods near Vanhoover! :raritywink:

4532480

Naw. It’s magic, man! Don’t forget there’s a jungle temple somewhere in the woods near Vanhoover! :raritywink:

I prefer to limit the amount of superspells per second. :)

Just realized: That ending, where the CMC set up Featherbangs with all three of his groupies? The herders are going to go nuts over this.

I was so enchanted by classic Crusader adorableness that I ignored a lot of the cringe comedy, but they actually kind of screwed the moral. All the original CMC "ploys" like robbing Sugar Belle or sexually assaulting her while she sleeps fail of course, but the "correct" answer given is to break into her shop/home and remodel it without her consent? That's almost as much a fairy-tale trope as the first tries!

4531441 Good to know someone else would have voted for Mayor Glim-Glam.

4533017

That’s almost as much a fairy-tale trope as the first tries!

I maintain there is no appreciable difference between tropes and what people actually do. The apparent divergence between “fairytale” and “reality” is primarily subjective, and is mostly the consequence of selection bias.

Unfortunately, ignoring that is also a trope. :)

So that whole moral is false from the beginning. The original ploys fail because Sugar Belle believes she is a character type other than a fairytale princess, which is what Big Mac eventually realizes – not because strategies based on applying a trope do not work in general.

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he original ploys fail because Sugar Belle believes she is a character type other than a fairytale princess, which is what Big Mac eventually realizes

That makes sense. I thought it was just she wanted a guy who listened to her.

Also, one more point of canon: Night Glider and Party Favor are eating lunch together when they are interrupted by the CMC. If you pause it for the one second before the Crusaders actually interrupt, those two are making "bedroom eyes" at each other. So I guess the circle of shipping continues.

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I thought it was just she wanted a guy who listened to her.

Think about it in depth. That’s also a story, isn’t it?

Just a different genre, but ultimately, every love story is learned behavior start to finish.

Also, one more point of canon: Night Glider and Party Favor are eating lunch together when they are interrupted by the CMC.

I saw that, but wasn’t sure if I should write this up or not, seemed too minor. Also guaranteed to be forgotten next time. :)

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Just a different genre, but ultimately, every love story is learned behavior start to finish.

Fair enough.

Also guaranteed to be forgotten next time. :)

We're building canon sandcastles, my friend.

4533063 So Sugar Belle identifies as the Cobbler archtype rather than the Princess? Fair enough. So the CMC elves break in and cobble some... display cases?

BTW, callback to the handy Apple Bloom, back when we thought the three of them would get marks that represented their individuality. :twilightangry2:

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Feather Bangs is a huge meta joke. He's voiced by Vincent Tong, Flash Sentry's voice actor. What's his cutie mark? It's a feather getting in between two hearts i.e. him, getting in between Big Mac and Sweetie Belle. Except, those two hearts aren't necessarily Big Mac and Sweetie Belle, so that must mean his talent must be getting in between two lovers.

That's exactly what some fans accused Flash Sentry of doing, getting in between Twilight and... whatever their preferred pairing for Twilight happened to be.

This character's talent is stealing "waifus".

However, in universe, this means his cutie mark was gained for a negative talent, one that has a deleterious effect on others.

4535088 Fun fact: Vincent Tong voiced not only Flash Sentry, but also Blueblood and Garble. But I feel like the character's hair, voice and singing were definitely made to specifically evoke Justin Bieber.

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That would mean subscribing to the view that the mark is destiny, and will appear and remain the same no matter what the pony does or how they behave. So crusading for cutie marks is absolutely pointless, and getting a mark that is incompatible with life is actually likely.
I’m pretty sure that view is not canon compatible.

I feel like that view is pretty darn backed by canon. All the alternate futures we saw in the S5 finale had the same ponies with the same cutie marks, and human versions of ponies in EQG have identical cutie marks to their pony equivalent.

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I feel like that view is pretty darn backed by canon. All the alternate futures we saw in the S5 finale had the same ponies with the same cutie marks, and human versions of ponies in EQG have identical cutie marks to their pony equivalent.

Ponies sure don’t behave like they’re Calvinists, though, do they? :)

The parallelism of alternate futures as well as Pedestrian symbolism are driven by temporal inertia: “Time is a river, where even the tiniest changes seen can lead to a cascade of effects downstream.” If cutie marks are statements of identity, rather than foreordained destiny that cannot be changed, we never saw an example of a mark that could be different, because the experiences forming the core of that identity were still further up the stream, and the remaining months between the Rainboom that didn’t happen and finally getting the actual mark were comparatively unimportant.

Pedestria, however, is a world defined as a mirror, and a mirror simply cannot go to the world where cutie marks do not match the symbols used.

Thought: As you say in the chronology project, it's possible this episode was actually before Hearthbreakers. In that case, we could clearly explain Apple Bloom's statement about Big Mac never before having a crush. I guess we'll see what the writers do with Big Mac / Sugar Belle shipping later on. Frankly, this episode's so painful to watch that I wouldn't mind forgetting it altogether.

(And I can believe the Crusaders keeping the Big Mac x Cheerilee picture up. Perhaps it's a piece of history for them, or perhaps they keep it as a reminder of what not to do.)

This episode is being written up three weeks before its US airing, so you should know the drill by now.

Three weeks later…OP response.
Other barns.
♪Week!
Binoculars.
♪"How many spies do you know[, Scootaloo]?" "That's not important"
-not zero.
♪"Love potions don't count"
♪"No love potions!"
❧❧MacKintosh is, for once, VERY anti-mind-control, breaking the all-pony seven-season streak.
❧Feather-bangs is getting those sets, props…where? Answer: he winkks at the camera at the end, he has 4th-wall powers.
♪"Is it possible to have a crush on more than one pony?" minor-josses polyamory, open relationships as common. Or, of course, Scootaloo doesn't know anything. As this is in the pattern of the other romance ep, it's moderately safe to say the CMC are clueless.
∃Cherry blossom…which would be on the farm? Those aren't ground flowers on Earth, and the petals usually don't come off as an intact flower like that.
backup dancers bipedal.
❧Fontawesome lacks a good textiles icon.
❧Backup dancer: baseball cap, backward (see: 1990s)
MacKintosh can play the banjo. With a hoof.
❧CMC should've camped the cart for Mac to return.
❧Sugar Belle's panniers are not Cutie Mark-personalized. This has an obvious explanation, though: Starlight Glimmer nigh-certainly mandated such decorations be removed, and never got around to redoing them.
That phonograph's crank isn't turning.
Kisses are not in evidence. Nose-bumps are. covered…?


the nose glasses

Groucho Glasses.

better ears

I'll just cheat and use the transcript.

Scootaloo and Sweetie Belle: He's training for a marathon!
Apple Bloom: He's probably picking a lot of broccoli...


Apple Bloom: ...and he wants to get away from the smell!

nobody even mentions Marble.

"Hard to say anything"…I suspect their mutual silence was friendly, but they couldn't voice expressions of affection, so both thought it wasn't a real thing.

This is the only admission that the Moon has any kind of phases in the primary canon.

I doubt it, but I don't have a counterexample handy.

Feather Bangs pushes Big Mac away is in itself notable. Might be a cutie mark effect – his cutie mark is a feather between two hearts.

…well, now I have a lewd interpretation of his name. Unfortunately, it's two hearts, not three: one of his public admirers will be culled.

Oh, and
♥ Are those crush-heart-bubbles/irises and "oh how romantic" ones diegetic, I wonder?
That's more display shelving than a display case, without glass…perhaps cartoon resolution ate the notches for glass?
Applebloom is good at carpentry.
The quote-everyone post.

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…you're suggesting that, as Watsonians, we should treat the second-level tale in a Doylist fashion. :raritywink:
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A lot of this episode really kind of reinforces traditional gender roles (for American audiences),

:raritycry: How damning.

Our Town, have they still not come up with a proper name for it? Seems like a missed opportunity.

I don't see why they would—it refers to the shared experiences of
1. being cutie-mark traumatized that they wanted to go to Our Town
2. throwing off Starlight Glimmer.
Directly relatable to 1 pretty much restricts it to the Other 5 (non-Twi mane 6, from Starswirl's Unfinished Spell), Starlight Glimmer herself, and the CMC, who have talent-granted sympathy for cutie-mark situations.
Notably absent from list: Big MacKintosh. (though, he was said to have gotten his "last in his class"…)
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It definitely felt like two middle segments of "this isn't going to work because we've not exhausted episode time yet", yes.
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Ha!
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I see it as Getting Crap Past the Radar.
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"before the sun comes up, we're going to build on this site an exact replica of the town of Rock Ridge."
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Dragons need damsels in distress. Seriously need more poly/herd relationship representation.

Spike seems to think so, too, by Dog&Pony Show. However, see above: Scootaloo had to ask if it was possible for someone to have multiple simultaneous crushes…
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Way back in "Hearts and Hooves Day,"

That's forward from here, but good point.
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Been reading about Rakshastan?
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Well, there are those in-transit animations with the curvature being in-shot-visible at varying zoom levels, which throws wrenches into measuring…
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The northern permafrost is clearly supernatural. (It's caused by spirits, which are also supernatural, according to Twilight.)
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I anticipate that, as soon as a writer notices, we'll get FB's backup dancers walking with his groupies in a background while he looks on sadly.
4535088 :pinkiegasp:

4531936 I think I've found the perfect explanation for Feather Bangs, via FanOfMostEverything's blog on the episode, quoted here:

Someone call Svengallop. We have a manufactured pop star who escaped the factory.

Suddenly, him not actually knowing how to talk to girls makes all of the sense.

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