Spoony and April see Avengers 2: Age of Ultron

They hated it for the exact reasons I hated it and that makes me feel alive.

Comments

[Batbrony]

While I still enjoyed Avengers 2 immensely, I remember watching this back in May and agreeing with them on many points. I guess I still accept it since for me, being a DC guy, I'm totally fine with Marvel being the less serious of the two (and no, just because a movie's not as serious doesn't mean it can't be smart, I'm fully aware of that and Captain America: The Winter Soldier is perfect proof of that). The experience, though, for me is what counted, and it was a rollicking good time both times I saw it. I guess my biggest complaint is that it was blatantly obvious that they handed Joss Whedon a checklist of plot points and said, "OK, you have to get through a couple dozen or so of these plot points while still trying to make a movie that stands on its own." I mean, blatantly obvious. But I can kind of forgive that considering that what Marvel is doing with tying all these movies together has never really been done before and is, if nothing else, incredibly ambitious. Perhaps if other studios try to repeat it down the road they'll learn from these early mistakes. Or repeat them spectacularly, we are slow learners after all.

[Darth Gonzo]

3181657 You should watch Daredevil on Netflix and then tell me that Captain America Winter Soldier is the most serious thing that Marvel has made so far.

[Batbrony]

3181678
I am watching Daredevil on Netflix and forgot to mention that, though I don't necessarily count a TV property either as part of the Marvel CINEMATIC Universe even if it is canon with it since they're very different mediums in which one can do very different things.

[Darth Gonzo]

3181682 Daredevil is going to appear in the next Avengers movie.

[Batbrony]

3181714
Well that's cool. Not like that movie's gonna turn into Daredevil though. How great would that be, they're all talking about how to stop Thanos and suddenly Daredevil and Kingpin walk in and spend the next 10 minutes arguing in front of everyone about the nature of good and evil, and the meaning of Kingpin's wall-decor.

[Darth Gonzo]

3181725 Well I can't wait for Season 2 because the Punisher is going to appear in it.

[Jabberwocky1996]

THANK YOU SPOONY.

[Avenging-Hobbits]

3181657 Actually, all the plot failures of Age of Ultron fall squarely on the shoulders of Whedon.

For example, Winter Soldier screenwriters Christopher Markus and Stephen McFeely were given the same checklist of plot points and necessities for the broader universe, and they created the screenplay to The Winter Soldier, which, while having some flaws in the third act (mostly the dismantling of Shield with little to no REAL consequence).

Keep in mind that Whedon was basically allowed to play in the sandbox of the MCU, while completely disregarding the continuity of the other films, including saying that Bucky should have stayed dead (even though he had no input on either First Avenger OR Winter Soldier), and that reviving Coulson was a mistake and that he does not consider Agents of Shield canon when writing Age of Ultron, even though he wrote and directed the pilot, and served as an executive producer on the first season.

Here's his quote (bold italics mine):

A lot of people come back in The Winter Soldier. It’s a grand Marvel tradition. Bucky was supposed to die. And the Coulson thing was, I think, a little anomalous just because that really came from the television division, which is sort of considered to be its own subsection of the Marvel universe. As far as the fiction of the movies, Coulson is dead.

But I have to say, watching the first one with my kids—I had not watched the first one since it came out—and then watching it with my kids and watching Coulson die but [thinking], “Yeah, but I know that he kind of isn’t,” it did take some of the punch out of it for me. Of course, I spent a lot of time making sure he didn’t. And at the time it seemed inoffensive, as long as it wasn’t referenced in the second movie, which it isn’t.

There’s a thing where you can do that so many times and there’s nothing at stake. But it’s difficult because you’re living in franchise world—not just Marvel, but in most big films—where you can’t kill anyone, or anybody significant. And now I find myself with a huge crew of people and, although I’m not as bloodthirsty as some people like to pretend, I think it’s disingenuous to say we’re going to fight this great battle, but there’s not going to be any loss. So my feeling in these situations with Marvel is that if somebody has to be placed on the altar and sacrificed, I’ll let you guys decide if they stay there.

Source

Therefore, Whedon wishes to keep Quicksilver dead, which is a callous waste of the story potential his existence can bring with his interactions with Wanda, and the other Avengers.

Long story short, Whedon has no one to blame but himself for the complete, unmitigated disaster that Age of Ultron was on a world building and story telling level, and the complete disregard he paid towards the character development the characters underwent in their respective solo films.

3181714 You mean Infinity War?

There's no proof of that beyond completely unsubstantiated rumors, so therefore I will ignore it until it's confirmed via a site like Variety or Screenrant, or Marvel itself. Otherwise, I'm just hyping myself up for something that is most likely pointless.

However, Charlie Cox (Daredevil's actor), has expressed interest to be in a properfilm with the rest of the team.

[Batbrony]

3182085
I'm not saying it doesn't fall on Whedon's shoulders too. If there's a flaw about him, it's that I've never heard him ever suggest he did anything wrong in any of his productions. I mean, I know that's hard for people in those creative positions in general to do, but he seems especially bad at it. He's had a lot more bad or mediocre stuff on his resume than people think, but if there's anyone who has complete, 120% faith in the way Whedon makes films or shows, it's Whedon. And that's never a good thing for any filmmaker; for example, just contrast it to the evident respect that Christopher Nolan always had for the Batman universe. Sure he did his own things, but he was always very forthcoming and honest about the fact that not only was he working with adapted material, but there was plenty material in the comic books already that he was going to draw from and heavily admired. I don't know if I've ever once heard Whedon express similar admiration for the material he's drawing from; he seems much more excited always about what he's doing with the material than what the material has done already. Humility in creativity can go a long way, especially again if you're working with material that's not entirely your own. Ah well, no matter, he won't be touching Infinity War, so I'm a happy cookie.

[Avenging-Hobbits]

3182094 Exactly.

While I have qualms about the Dark Knight trilogy, I can never say it disrespected the material or anything. One always had the feeling that Nolan had deep admiration and respect for Batman, and therefore it translated to the films.

Any flaws I have with the films are more flaws that show up in Nolan's films in general (an emotional distance, emphasis on visuals and style over character development or interaction).

Wheres with Whedon, there's this perpetual creeping sense of arrogance and self righteousness that never quite goes away.

[Silver Screen]

I had to see the movie in the next town, because a lot of german cinemas refused to play it, because Disney charged to much money. Later on, it was shown in my own city. The first time, I watched it in a better theater (it even had a cutain), I had way more room for my legs, I ate much more and better quality popcorn and nachos, with a jumbo soft drink, and still paid less than the second time.

Now for my opinion on the movie.
The first time watching it, I was disappointed. I noticed a lot of plotholes. I had the feeling that Ultrons goal was constantly changing, the origin of Vision felt kinda weird to me, Thor was only there to keep the plot going, the romance between Banner and Widow came totally out of nowhere. Ultron was made a little funny and even a little human, which I think, backfired. They instantly killed Baron von Strucker, one of my favourite Marvel villains.
But how could I have not been disappointed? The hype for this movie rose higher and higher, since the day the first one was in theaters. With all the build up we had with trailers and TV spots, it was made to disappoint.
But I still enjoyed it.

And the second time I watched it, I had none of these complaints. Yes the second time I watched it, it was way better.

Oh, and Avenging-Hobbits? Thanks for inspiring me to write my own crossover fictions with One Piece.

[Avenging-Hobbits]

3189947 well i'm happy i inspired someone :)

[Silver Screen]

3190163 Problem is, I don't consider myself a good writer. It's just that I thought it should be done, but nobody does it, so I'm gonna do it. Think of it as an incentive for a better writer to start doing a better job.

[Avenging-Hobbits]

3190341 and hey, I wasn't exactly a spectacular writer when I started, and yet here we are.

So its totally possible you can accomplish something awesome

[Silver Screen]

3190366 I's prefer the term "epic", but thanks.