> A Thorn in His Side > by Darunian > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- > A Thorn in His Side > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- Caramel licked the envelope shut with an overwhelming sense of satisfaction. He trotted triumphantly from the desk he had been writing at, past the nearby bin that was overflowing with previous attempts. He even managed to step on a few that had spilled onto the floor, confident his newest creation was what he was after. He held in his mouth the prize he had set down to write, the greatest love letter in the history of Equestria. Well, perhaps not the greatest in Equestria, but it didn't hurt to hope. Besides, all that mattered was that Rose saw its worth. As he opened the door to his home, he could see the evening sun beginning to set and realized that his amorous task had taken the better portion of his day. It was too late for Rose to receive his letter today. He put a forehoof to his head in reconsideration. Then again, the mailmare wasn't particularly known for her punctuality, he'd have just as good a chance of speedy delivery at any hour. It was hard to actually say when Derpy made her rounds... His thoughts trailed off as he gazed down the street where Rose was closing her stand for the day. How beautiful she was, especially in the twilight hour. How he longed to tell her how radiant she was. Her mane was so lustrous in the evening sun, the dark rays caught in her almost crimson mane. He longed to stroke her glowing raspberry mane and hold his head to hers, lost in a blanket of soft hairs. To hold her hooves in his, to stare into her green eyes, and to kiss every inch of her body, was all Caramel ever wanted in life. How he longed to be there, with her, happy and madly in love. A wistful sigh left his lips, and free as a songbird. He wondered if these fantasies would ever be anything more, but decided it was best not to dwell much longer on the topic. Besides, the thoughts were a little more than arousing and arrousing thoughts often lead to embarrassing situations. He blushed inadvertently picturing a few of these thoughts and was suddenly pulled from then when he was startled by a hopping pink pony, bounding in his direction. "Hiya, Caramel!" Pinkie said. She was smiling so brightly Caramel had to shield his eyes a bit. "Ooo... Your face is really, really, really red! You look like a strawberry which is funny because that's what the Cakes were making in their cakes today! Oh! You must've had one and now you're wondering what it's like to be a strawberry, so..." Pinkie rambled on. She continued sharing all sorts of interesting coincidences that she had noticed, eighteen of them in the last hour alone. However, Caramel made the mistake many ponyfolk make in that he didn't pay full attention to what Pinkie was saying. Not only was it rude, but it often lead to a very awkward shift in conversation. Caramel forgot this however, and wasn't able to stop her before she remarked, "And then I wondered, 'why is he staring at Rose again? I bet he likes her a lot,' and that's when I came over here to talk to you!" Caramel turned an even darker shade of crimson, casting his gaze to the ground, and kicking a forehoof at the dirt in a vain attempt to hide his interest in Rose. Keeping his gaze lowered, Caramel stammered, "Well, I don't know why you'd think that, I was just-". He turned to look at Rose's flower stand behind him, and pieced together an excuse. "Going to buy some flowers for my, uh, mother is all, her birthday is, um, soon?" was the best he had. He turned back to look where Pinkie was standing, but she wasn't there. Before Caramel could relax knowing that he wouldn't have to try and fool Pinkie Pie today, an energetic voice piped up nearby, "Ooo, lookie! Somepony left a letter in your mailbox!" The mailbox front burst open as Pinkie's hooves and head poked out of the much too small mailbox. The mailbox reared back like the arm of a trebuchet before rocketing forward and launching the nosy mare to the ground in front of Caramel. She seemed content enough to lie prostrate and watch the lazy descent of the letter as it daintily on top of her chest. "Ooo and it's to Rose!" she looked slyly up at Caramel, a stallion stricken by both the ridiculousness of what Pinkie had just done and the fear of being found out, his heart skipped nearly three beats. She put on her best detective face as she said, "I know just what you're up to, Caramel-" "It's not what it looks like, I can explain-" Caramel nervously interrupted. Pinkie spoke slowly, emphasizing each word, "Well, well, well," She looked as if she had made a big break in the case, the kind that gets an ace detective a brand new office. She continued, "It looks like you must love her a whole lot!" Caramel nearly panicked. "She'll be super happy when she finds out that you got her a super-de-duperdy big batch of flowers! Moms love flowers!" Pinkie exclaimed. Caramel froze, expecting her to figure out his feelings for Rose, but this was much better. After he wiped away the densely collected sweat from his brow, Caramel lied, "Yes, it's, uh, that." It seemed the speaking part of his brain was still racing to get back to him. Pinkie placed a hoof in Caramel's mane and ruffled his hair. She gloated, "Ha, I knew it!" The pink gumshoe reveled in her victory before suddenly freezing like a startled deer. "Oh my golly gosh, I should get flowers too! They'll look great at the rock farm!" In an instant, she was gone. As a small dust cloud begin to dissipate in front of Caramel, all he could hear was a distant, "Thanks Caramel!" and he could just barely make out a tiny pink dot in the distance. Who knows where she planned on getting flowers? It clearly wouldn't be at Rose's stand. He calmly picked up the discarded letter and placed it once more in his mailbox. He turned once more to distantly admire Rose. She was was just now taking down the "open for business" sign blissfully unaware of her admirer just down the street. This was the situation he hoped his letter would fix. As he closed the door behing him, he wondered if he really had a chance, but realized the answer would have to wait until at least tomorrow. At any rate, a lonely dinner awaited Caramel. He felt the need to get a head start on it, as if eating an earlier dinner would mean the day followed suit. As Caramel sat eating his dinner for one, he couldn't help but dwell on his recently peaking feelings for Rose. Sure they'd grown up together in Ponyville, but he had always been more of a friend to her, and she likewise. He had been there for her while other stallions had trampled her heart into a fine dust. With as many tears she shed into his shoulder, he figured he might be at least part sponge now. During these crying fits, Caramel consoled her as only he was able to do. It was during these sessions that he noticed whenever she'd pull her head away, momentarily attempting to regain her composure, streaks from fresh tears showing on her cheeks, that he began to notice just how lovely her eyes were. Her mane also maintained its beauty to him, even when disheveled and straying every which way. For the longest time, he had realized that he really loved Rose, and felt awful that he had not shared these feelings earlier. Those times when her world was falling apart and he stood there holding it together. He felt he was taking advantage of the situation and each day his guilt gnawed at him just a little bit more. He liked not to think about these things, so he took a particularly fierce bite out of his meal snapping his mind back into the here and now. Back in the present, Caramel noticed just how little he had actually eaten. He attributed his recent lack of appetite and difficulty sleeping to lovesickness. Food simply lost its flavor while sleeping was hard when his heart ached the way it did. He had been much too afraid to confess his feelings for far too long, afraid of what Rose's response might be. His letter, however, would be the perfect prescription for what ailed his lonely heart. He worried now that in his writing he revealed too much interest instead of innocent infatuation. He hoped not to frighten her by sharing what he knew to be true, he was madly in love. Once more, Caramel made the effort to return to reality. As his released their stranglehold on his mind, Caramel noticed that the sun was now sleeping below the horizon, and his meal was no closer to being finished. He set the meal aside, leftovers for some other time. Caramel sighed deeply as the excitement of the day's events and the worries of anxious speculation subsided and exhaustion took hold. He lifted himself into his bed and collapsed on top of it. He wrapped himself in the blankets and hoped sleep would arrive soon to hasten the dawn of a new day. He tossed and turned as hours passed by, while sleep seemed agonizingly out of reach. Unable to drift into dreams, his mind wandered. His mind began at the watershed of love he felt in his heart. These thoughts trickled into the achingly slow stream of longing, before the current of his thoughts grew swifter until final funneling into the raging river of lust. Images of Rose and himself sharing a very physical, mutual love flooded his mind, a maelstrom of carnal fantasy. The images played before his mind. The two of them would lock muzzles, eyes gazing into one another's. He would press his hoof to her chest, stroking softly her delicate coat. He would bask in her warmth of her precious body, and he would allow himself to be lost in the symphonic motions of her peaceful breathing. Locked hoof in hoof, they'd cuddle as time gave way to a loving eternity. Rose would have her head pressed to his chest, where the ticking of his heart would be the only way to know that time did not stand still. He would then lean forward and lightly playfully nibble her ear, an opportunity to breathe in deep the strong scent of the many bouquets she worked with each day. A soft chuckle would escape her lips, as she became aware of Caramel's playful advances. As if by accident, she would let slip a single hoof, lower and lower, down his chest, pausing to draw small circles here and there, artfully avoiding the unspoken question that throbbed between his legs. Nestled between two lean, yellow-coated legs, his flared, brown member stood ready, eager for any attention Rose was willing to provide. A teasing hoof cautiously touched the base of Caramel's shaft before tantalizingly sliding to the flared summit. Caramel was eagerly stroking himself by this point. The mere thought of her touch, excited him in ways he had not felt for anypony else. Precum leaked eagerly from the tip of his shaft as his hooves nearly rocketed up and down its length. In his mind, her gentle caress quickly escalated as the imagined couple began expressing their love with every inch of their sweat-covered bodies. The images drove Caramel onward, as the sprawled out stallion worked intensely on his painfully rigid member. His voracious efforts would soon be rewarded as Caramel felt his much-needed release building swiftly. His thick shaft began to tingle with the anticipation of his oncoming climax. Rose straddled him, her eyes gazing deep into his own. She leaned forward quickly to press her lips to his, a hot, loving kiss that took him by surprise before he melted in its heat. Thick ropes of cum erupted from his member in ecstatic succession coating his bed in warm, sticky splotches. Yet another strand of cum shot from his member, nearly as thick, further covering his bed in his heated love. The white ropes made new stains in the sheets, while some landed all the way in his mane. He panted heavily as his member began to soften to the touch, the room thick with the scent of his musk. He then rolled to his side and smiled to himself. He whispered to the night, "I love you, Rose." His afterglow glow subsided as bliss gave way to slumber. A sharp knock woke Caramel from his sleep. He groggily rolled over and used his hooves to pry his eyes open. He gazed out a nearby window and noticed the moon looking back from the peak of the night sky. Eyebrows furrowed in confusion, he wondered who would have the nerve to wake him at this hour. With great effort, he pulled himself from his bed, put his hooves on the ground, and shuffled half-conscious towards the door. Caramel had just reached his front door when his mystery guest knocked once more, likely unaware that Caramel had even made it out of bed. Suppressing every instinct to open the door and berate the horrendously rude pony he expected to find, Caramel opened the door with the kindest grimace he could manage. Yet, as he opened the door, his grimace faded instantly and his eyes widened in surprise, unable to comprehend who he was seeing. Before him stood Rose, front hoof crossing the other, head down, apparently looking at the floor of Caramel's home. Caramel had seen this posture before and it meant Rose had quite a bit on her mind. Unlike the other times he had seen her like this however, there were no tears formed in her eyes and to his knowledge she wasn't even dating. Rose piped up, "I'm sorry if I woke you." "Don't worry about it." "I just have a few things I need to get off my chest, and I don't think they can wait till morning," Rose said. She lifted her eyes to meet Caramel's gaze and added, "Do you mind if I come inside?" Caramel nodded and stood aside to make way for the mare. If he had been any more awake and less drowsy, his mind would be buzzing with questions, but as he was, he merely accepted the situation with all the passivity of one lost in dream. He closed the door behind her, and he turned around expecting to see her making her way to the couch. Instead, she was standing directly in front of him, dangerously close. She learned in quickly and kissed him. As their muzzles locked, she let her tongue teasingly press against his mouth, probing for an answer from the stunned Caramel. In an instant, his worries and fears were absolved in Rose's surprising advances. Sure, this was progressing far faster than he had ever imagined, but as his tongue rushed to meet Rose's he realized, he was totally fine with that. Rose pulled away shortly after Caramel's tongue met hers as a cocky grin spread across her face. Her eyes were ablaze like dark emeralds. A devilish grin quickly told hold as she spoke, "Do you know why I'm here, Caramel?" Caramel's mouth opened as if to speak, but no words left him. Rose continued, "I know how you feel about me, how much you want me." She leaned in and kissed his neck, her lips playing upon his flesh as her words played upon his heart. Caramel's legs quivered as the mare of his dreams was pressing herself onto him. With Rose so close to him, tickling his neck with her tongue, he held her as close as he could manage. Being so close to her, he realized that he didn't seem to smell the flowers she had worked with that day. Perhaps she bathed before arriving? Not a problem. Her eyes were as beautiful as ever, but seemed darker than he remembered. No issue there. This was most likely due to how dim the room was. "But, Caramel," Rose said, pulling back from Caramel's neck, "How do I know for sure you want me? How do I know it's not a ruse?" Caramel raised an eyebrow quizzically as Rose turned slightly to the side. He wondered for a moment how to play his cards. The possibilities played out in his mind, but evaporated when his eyes caught sight of a masculine protrusion growing ever rigid beneath his lover's belly. "Well, Caramel," the clearly male Rose said, "Do you really want me?" Caramel's fatigue addled mind could hardly process this utterly unexpected unveiling. Surely during the many years he had known Rose, he would have noticed something like this beforehand, and yet somehow he had not. Was he blind or was Rose excellent at hiding things? He almost grew angry at the thought that she had hid something like this from him, and yet he realized he had done the same with his feelings. When he wrote the letter, he did it to expose the secrets he held. It was only fair, that Rose was allowed to do the same. Sure it was unusual, shocking even, but Caramel was not the type to let last minute surprises burden him. He knew he loved Rose. A love stronger than any he had felt before. Even though Rose was very clearly a stallion like himself, it was not enough to discourage him. He loved Rose through and through. Caramel leaned in close to his expectant lover. Without uttering a word, he looked into Rose's eyes and slid a hoof to Rose's underside, lightly stroking the rigid member he found there as he pressed his mouth to Rose. He was ravaging the fellow stallion's mouth with his tongue. He pressed onward with the assault, worshipping Rose's tongue with his own. His ferocity spoke volumes on the intensity of his love for Rose. In Caramel's mind, nothing had changed. Rose blushed and moaned lightly at Caramel's breathtaking performance. Caramel continued locking tongues with Rose as he led the entangled pair to his nearby bed. He pressed Rose to the mattress. The raspberry maned stallion was first to the bed, lying on his back. Rose's member stood at attention while his face was red with heat and lust. The surprise stallion looked expectantly at Caramel, eager to see his next move. Caramel's mind overflowing that it was with lust, climbed atop his lover, sliding his brown member along Rose's much thicker black shaft. He pressed his forehooves into Rose's as he pressed his muzzle into the green-eyed stallion's pale yellow neck. He kissed his way up to Rose's mouth, pressing his tongue inside as the pair exchanged impassioned moans. Caramel had pinned Rose to the bed and had no intention of letting them leave. Caramel worked himself slowly from Rose's mouth, back to their neck, licking, kissing, and gently sucking all the while. Rose's girly moans were music to his ears, an enticing reward for his efforts. Caramel unpinned one of Rose's forearms and sensually slid it across the stallion's stomach, gently resting atop Rose's orbs. They were warm and heavy, cushiony to Caramel's touch as he toyed with them. He had never done this with a stallion before, but he hoped Rose couldn't tell. Rose was squirming under the tantalizing touch of Caramel's lusty advances. Light moans filled the air as Caramel moved his mouth ever lower, making small circles on Rose's stomach, dangerously close to the throbbing member aching for attention. Caramel reared back from Rose's body and used his hooves to hold Rose's member in front off his face. With the equine length between his blue eyes, he gazed seductively into Rose's eyes as a devious grin spread across his face. He waited until he saw the desperation in his lover's face before he pressed his tongue to the base of Rose's cock. Rose excitedly exhaled, eager for more as he kept his eyes on the stallion between his legs, face obscured by his equine length. Caramel then dragged his tongue up Rose's pillar, feeling each and every vein along the way. As his tongue reached the flared peak, he found a river of pre flowing onto his tongue that he eagerly slurped up. Feeling the heat of the moment practically burning his face, Caramel decided to pick up the pace. He wrapped his mouth around Rose's thick member, no small feat. Rose moaned deeply at finding his flared tip now engulfed in Caramel's warm, moist mouth. Caramel pressed his hooves to Rose's hips. With a Cutie Mark held by either hoof for grip, Caramel began working his mouth further down Rose's cock. He slid his mouth down slowly, taking in inch after inch, slowly but surely. He reached about halfway before deciding to ascend, dragging his tongue up along the shaft all the while. Caramel pulled his mouth off of Rose's member and placed a few more teasing licks on the tip. He found a thick blush spreading across Rose's face, clearly enjoying his handiwork. Encouraged by Rose's reaction, Caramel once more went down on the slick member inches from his muzzle. His head sunk lower and lower, as he took Rose's member into his mouth inch by inch. With half of Rose's shaft in his mouth, Caramel began bobbing up and down on the thick rod. Wet slurping noises escaped from Caramel's full mouth here and there, as Rose moaned ever louder. A pale yellow hoof found its way atop Caramel's brown mane, pressing lightly to hold Caramel's head on Rose's member, not that he needed the encouragement. Caramel was sliding at an increasing pace across the slickened member when he felt Rose's other hoof suddenly pressed against his forehead, pushing him off. Surprised, Caramel looked up at his Rose's face, saliva strands trailing from his mouth. After a contented sigh, Rose said, "Caramel, I need to know something." Rose's wet shaft slapped against Caramel's face as he shot back, "Sure, anything." Caramel was a fairly disappointed being interrupted, and he couldn't help the deep blush spreading across his face, when he realized just how much he enjoyed sucking off Rose. "Well," Rose said as he began suggestively sliding a hoof up his wet cock, "you told me you wanted me, but just how much do you want me?" Caramel climbed forward a bit onto the bed, placing his head on Rose's chest. His own member slid across the ruffled sheets as he did so, a sensual reminder of his own growing need. He made small circles on Rose's chest with his hoof as he gathered every bit of poetic talent he had to say, "More than your roses need the sun." Rose giggled as he placed a hoof on Caramel's rump and said, "Are you sure?" Caramel pieced together what Rose was getting at now. Although he worried about what his answer would mean for him, he responded after a slight pause, "I'm sure." In a matter of moments, Rose had freed himself from under Caramel and repositioned himself atop the young stallion. As Caramel stood with his rear legs on the ground before the bed, member pointed directly at the floor, and forehooves flat on the mattress, he began to worry now about what he was about to do. He had never been with a stallion before, and was understandably less than experienced in this sort of thing. As if sensing Caramel's worry, Rose wrapped his forehooves around Caramel's chest and leaned forward to kiss Caramel's cheek. "Don't worry, sweetie, I'll be gentle." Rose said. A short kiss followed, and Caramel then felt something very hard and very wet pressing against into his plot. For extra reassurance or perhaps leverage, Rose had wrapped his forehooves around Caramel's stomach more tightly than before. He then began slowly pressing the tip of his thick shaft into Caramel's tense rear. Caramel's eyes bulged as he felt the head of Rose's cock press into his more than tight ass. Rose grunted at the overwhelming resistance that practically forced his shaft right back out. Rose gripped Caramel even tighter and found that the stallion was practically shaking, but resolved to please his lover had said not a word. Rose continued sliding his throbbing member into Caramel's vice-like asshole. Slowly, Rose made progress. First he managed to slide in the head of his cock. He paused, this was tough work. Caramel was biting his bottom lip as Rose barely managed to then press in half of his thick cock. A pained groan escaped Caramel's mouth when to each stallion's surprise, Rose managed to bury the entirety of his member in Caramel's ass. Caramel, meanwhile could feel Rose's balls pressed to his rump and tried not to think about the fact that he felt as if he were being split in two. He hadn't anticipated just how well endowed Rose was. Rose started pulling his member from deep inside of Caramel. Slightly easier than stuffing the stallion, Rose managed to pull all of his member out, leaving in just the tip. Without the slightest pause for Caramel's consideration, Rose eagerly plunged the rest of his member back into Caramel, balls slapping against the yellow stallion's ass. A surprised "ah!" was all Caramel could manage as he felt the thick stallion meat deep inside. It was unlike anything Caramel had felt before. He couldn't tell if he liked it, it hurt, or if it was both at the same time, but Rose wasn't giving him much time to think about it. The girly stallion finding Caramel's body slightly more yielding started lightly thrusting in and out of him. Rose left his forehooves tightly wrapped around Caramel as he continued slowly thrusting into Caramel. Caramel was so incredibly tight that even with the slick coating of saliva Rose was surprised at just how difficult it was to keep himself inside of Caramel. Rose grunted and kept working his member in and out of Caramel, steadily building up a faster rhythm. Again and again Rose would pull almost all the way out before pounding his engorged member inside. Gentle, this wasn't. As Caramel once more felt Rose's member slam inside him, he was surprised to find himself starting to moan here and there. Maybe it was how forcefully his lover ravaged his virgin ass, the way having something so thick inside him felt just right, or the way his own pony member was pushed lengthwise against the front of the bed with each thrust that made him realize, he was starting to enjoy this. Feminine grunts filled the air as Rose had found a steady pace, plunging in and out of Caramel's plot. Caramel had adapted to the situation and was moaning along to the rhythm of Rose's thrusts, sweat dripping from his body. Rose's balls added their own claps to the melody of their lovemaking with each slap against Caramel's plump ass. Beneath the two sweaty stallions, Caramel's member was dragged against the bed's front again and again with each thrust of Rose's hips. Caramel could feel himself nearing orgasm as Rose started pistoning his ass. Rose clamped down even more tightly around Caramel. Stretching his neck forward, the rose-haired stallion planted his lips on Caramel's, sweat and saliva mixing as their tongues locked together. The pair were moaning into each other's mouths as Rose's hips picked up even more speed, slamming deeply in and out of Caramel at a blinding pace. In an instant, Rose plunged even deeper into Caramel. Firmly hilted in Caramel's plot, Roselock moaned deeply into Caramel's mouth as wave after wave of warm seed flooded Caramel's insides. For several moments, Caramel could feel Rose's cock throbbing inside him absolutely filling him with cum as he felt some of the deluge flowing out of him onto the floor below. The majority of Rose's seed dripped out of Caramel onto the floor below, but some of the stick excess had found its way onto Caramel's aching member. The sensation of being so thoroughly filled and his lover's cum sliding across his cock proved too much for Caramel as his own orgasm took hold. Thick strands of cum shot from his member onto the floor below, mixing with the puddle of cum that had escaped his ass. Rose slowly dislodged himself from Caramel's rear and climbed onto the bed with the deflowered stallion. Caramel wrapped Rose in a loving embrace, still panting from the intensity of his own orgasm. The two could barely share a brief "I love you" before rapidly drifting to sleep, still nestled in the other's hooves. Sometime later in the night, before the sun had risen, Rose carefully untangled himself from Caramel's cuddly hold. The surprise stallion quietly made his way to the door, and silently proceeded outside. After making sure he was on the outskirts of Ponyville, where no creature would see him, he blanketed himself with a surge of sparkling green energy. As the magical energy slowly rose up the stallion's body, the pale yellow coat gave way to a black jagged body. Where no wings were before, insect like ones had formed. His pleasing feminine muzzle was gone in an instant and a fanged jaw appeared in its place. Above these fangs now rested a pair of pupil-less blue eyes. "Rose" was nervous when Caramel had apparently noticed his imperfectly replicated eyes and the absence of flowers in his smell. He looked at his own member, the source of a great deal of worry, as he was unable to alter it during transformation. He wasn't strong enough to perfectly match another's appearance, but was forced instead to gamble on the strength of Caramel's love. It was the main challenge in his line of work, finding targets so madly in love that subtle differences in appearance is of no concern. It was a gauge to measure the depths of their affection, since, after all, love is blinding. Caramel awoke the next morning horrendously sore and even more so surprised to find Rose nowhere in sight. He mulled over the events of last night in his head while he went about preparing breakfast. Could any of that have been real? Sure, the bed was in disarray, but to be fair, it always looked like that after he awoke each morning. He bit firmly into the toast he had made. The smell of seed was certainly there, but it was possible that it was only his own. However, before he considered either of those things further, one thing in particular bothered him the most. He knew Rose was a mare. In fact, he had "accidentally" seen it a time or two. How could he mistake something like that? The evidence suggested last night was all in his head. After all, there's no way Rose could have even received his letter that night. The mail isn't even picked up till morning! He downed the glass of water he had filled, and realized that he simply must have been dream. He sat down and instantly bolted back up as the soreness of his rear reminded him that the night couldn't be decided so simply. "Well," he thought, pressing a hoof to his pained flank, "that I can't explain." Despite the pain in his rear, Caramel concluded that his lust addled mind had simply allowed a wonderfully detailed dream. One with very real pains afterward. In a matter of days, Rose would receive his letter and perhaps such dreams would no longer be necessary. He could only cross his hooves and hope she reciprocate his feelings. Until then, he would wait just as he had, in the perpetually agonizing state of limbo. He plopped himself onto his sofa, and continued to hope that one day she would be his Rose. As as he slumped on the comfy cushions, massaging his flank, he also hoped that she wouldn't have as many thorns.