This story is a sequel to With Tears in Her Eyes
Okay, fine. Here's something new to follow up on the last one, it was sort of half finished at the time anyway.
It is a time of celebration, of honor and joy. But is it really?
Twilight Sparkle has been a Princess for the better part of a year now, and Celestia has a gift made in honor of Equestria's newfound Princess of Friendship, as well as the Elements of Harmony. The Princesses and the Mane 6 have been gathered in the courtyard of Canterlot Castle with the townsponies for the grand reveal of the decorated statue paying homage to Twilight and her friends.
But after the ceremony, and the others have left, Cadence finds Luna staring forlornly upon the statue and decides to ask the Moon Princess what is troubling her.
NOTE: This needs to be edited, like all my other stuff. PM me if you're interested.
Prequel:
With Tears in Her Eyes
Sequels:
Tantabus
The Flower's Grove
Very well done!! This whole things jut makes me want to see the two sisters finally hash things out even more!! GAH!! And this was unfinished? Damn but that jut goes to show the kind of ability you have as a writer, I'd say!! Well done, and hope to see more in time!
Also, previous offer about help with writing still stands!!
7329155
I'm glad it was so well received, lol.
My usual editors have been super busy lately, which is totally fine, so I had to post it without it having been edited or proofread by anyone. It makes me happy to hear that it wasn't too bad after I ran my fingers through it a couple more times! Chances are, you'll see a lot more like this over time.
One of my favorite topics to toy around with is the subject of alicorns, magic, and how the MLP universe works. My thoughts are rarely always 100% show canon, but I think they're fun anyway.
It'd be nice to have someone to bounce ideas off of once in a while, so maybe I'll run some thoughts past you the next time I come up with something I feel like writing.
You said in your other story this was not intended to be a Celestia bashfic but to me it seems like you are writing one and it certainly seems as such in this one too. Now i won't downvote because its written well enough albit I have a hard time seeing this happening in canon but if I see it as an AU it seems like an Ok story. I'll explain why I feel this couldn't happen in canon:
*Celestia held the elements of kindness and generosity when fighting discord which together are probably the least likely personality traits to lead into how you describe Celestia in the past. It is highly unlikely that she would betray her elements because of her newfound power but I suppose it is possible.
*Giving you the benefit of the doubt lets say she did somehow turn into a power hungry tyrant after she came into power do you really think she would have been able to harness all 6 elements against Luna? It's pretty clear in the show that the elements have some kind of intelligence and also seems highly unlikely they would choose to side with her if she did act the way you say towards Luna.
*Cadance was chosen for ascension without any influence from Celestia as per her that "crystal heart spell" book which is about as canon of a backstory for Cadance as you can currently get. You could however certainly argue for Twilight's manipulation but even that you should remember that her cutie mark appeared on the tree of harmony before she was even born. It would be a monumental error on Celestia's part if she chose not to teach Twilight, if anything it seems like Celestia was trying to accelerate her ascension which could be taken as trying to manipulate her.
*Now for probably the thing that gets me the most riled up on these sorts of story's where Luna is blameless in her transformation into Nightmare Moon is that she really has no reason to feel any sort of regret for her actions nor any reason to even act civil around Celestia. If that were me i would be screaming the truth about the past at the top of my lungs and would certainly not have offered an apology as the first thing I would say to the being that caused me all that strife after i had been purged of NMM.
*In the show time and time again Luna has been shown as someone extremely remorseful about her own past actions, the fact that she resorted to torturing herself as a way to seek redemption speaks a lot about how she feels, If the events in your interpretation took place though I really see no reason Luna should feel any kind of remorse for what she did.
Now as rare as I see it happen I also hate when Celestia is presented as the Woobie instead of Luna as she is here. Although I do personally feel that Luna is more to blame for her transformation than Celestia is there is no doubt she did play a big role in her sister's fall.
*Celestia is never seen apologizing to Luna something i have always found pretty odd, while possible she did it off-screen Celestia always comes across as feeling self righteous about the whole thing even though Luna supports it. This could lead to what Luna did to herself in the whole tantabus fiasco as she could have felt that everything was entirely her own fault even though that might not have been the case.
*Even though Celestia might very well have the best interest in her subjects livelihood she seems like someone who is always looking at the bigger picture and always overlooking the individuals and those close to her. I feel that because of that she did not notice her subjects growing reverence towards her and the growing shadow she cast over Luna. My reason for believing this is the episode "For Whom the Sweetie Belle Toils" where Luna is speaking from experience to show the shadow Rarity casts over Sweetie Belle even though Rarity might actually be acting in Sweetie's best interest behind the scenes. I feel a lot of people overlook that little tidbit in that episode as it seems like the writers where trying showing parallels in both Sweeties and Luna's situations with their bigger sisters.
Really I'm tired of the countless blameless Luna story's and after reading the first part I was hoping you were not going down that path but after this one I really don't see how Luna could be blamed for anything that happened.
I'd argue this is an overused genre (The immortality part), but you did a fantastic job of giving two seemingly flawless ponies their own flaws.
Thanks for posting this it was a great read.
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To start, I'm sorry that it was a disappointment to you. But... one note is that these are written from their own perspectives, not taking into account what the other may or may not know, or what we know from watching in 3rd person. It's their perspectives on the situations, and as we all know, perceptions are often skewed when the whole truth isn't on the table.
I don't really agree that this one was necessarily hateful towards Celestia so much as attempting to portray her as a pony who feels sadness and longing as much as anypony else. That she's not perfect, and may still make selfish decisions. That even though she bore the elements of kindness and generosity, that she wasn't always kind and generous (which the show has canonly portrayed amongst a number of the mane 6 as well, that their elements can be sort of abused, or rather gone neglected, in a way). That being another reason I feel she may have lost her connection to her elements when all was said and done. But even Luna stated that Celestia should not be held on contempt for her actions, because while she sometimes questions her sister's decisions and intentions, she doesn't dislike her or doubt her kindness. She even stated that it should not be questioned that she loved her sister. She would still remember the bond they shared before everything went to pot for them. All Luna expects of it personally, is an eventual apology and peace to come at last to her sister. If she did not think Celestia was a fair ruler, or decided that she hated her still, I doubt she would have given up completely after she was stripped of her previous anger.
But anyway, this story is definitely more based on one of the headcanon possibilities of how things may have gone down. It's by no means show canon, probably something I should have stated in their description.
To answer this comment:
It would happen the very same way that it happened canonly in the show. She still used the elements that her sister was connected to against her in order to banish her. Also, in my first story, Celestia states that it was Luna's connection to her elements that lessened her sentence and allowed her eventual escape. It did not go unaccounted for, but the elements still recognized her as a danger, and followed through. Plus, afterward, the elements cut themselves off from Celestia's use, another reason she left them behind in the old castle until new ponies came along who could bear them properly.
Oh, also, on the note of Cadance... I'm actually too poor to be able to buy the comics and books that have been released.
I was completely unaware of any of that. But again, these stories I wrote are not necessarily intended to be show/story canon.
Another note: my intention was not to make Luna appear blameless, I had hoped part of the conversation with Cadance had portrayed that at least a little. She still tried to leave the world in eternal night, and take over forcefully. It's by no means denying that she went beyond kinda crazy. She deserved the imprisonment she got, something she'd admit openly within this canon, especially if you reference to the first story when Celestia mentions how much longer and bloodier the battle was between them, and that the ponies suffered for it. I meant to imply that ponies died because of Luna's rage and the battle that took place. This is one reason Luna doesn't react in the way you seem to expect she would in this scenario. She is guilty. Very much so. 1000 years to reflect on that, plus having all the anger from the past forcefully removed from your heart (like happened to her in episode 2), I imagine kind of takes that need out of you. It didn't matter to her who was "right or wrong", because in the end they were both wrong.
The way I view it, Luna's transformation into NMM was less "being taken over" as a lot of people like to think, I view it more as an altering of her physical form merely to reflect the rage she held inside. I believe it to have been a conscious decision on her part, at least within this headcanon, meaning that Celestia didn't force her into it either. But rather Celestia actions eventually led to Luna deciding for herself to make that change. Clearly it was a poor choice on her part, because it cost them both.
But yeah, explanation over. I hope maybe it helped a little? If not, then I guess this story just wasn't ever gonna work for you. I'm sorry it didn't turn out as you'd hoped, maybe next time I'll write something you end up liking better. Oh, and good luck with whatever your endeavors you have on here too.
Have a good day/night.
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Thank you!
I'm glad you enjoyed it. It's the first time I've written stories like this, so they may be a little less than they could have been, but I'm always trying to get better!
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I think the main thing throwing me off in this is Luna's seemingly having very little remorse. Basically in the first part Celestia rightfully piles the blame on herself and in this Luna pretty much reiterates the same thing Celestia said in the last fic plus even more. That's why to me it seems like a bashfic, Celestia doesn't have a leg to stand on and Luna seems to know as much. And like I said that's what makes it hard to believe this is the same Luna from the show whom seems to have endless remorse. If Luna's only fault was doing evil things after she was literally driven to madness by the acts of another it's hard to take her redemption as legitimate seeing how she was always originally a perfect pony. Maybe you're not making it clearer, did Luna do anything wrong in the past besides be a good like able pony? What reasons did she have to be jealous when she knew her sister was actively sabotaging her popularity?
Nice fic with good questions. But there too, you wrote "feet" instead of "hooves".
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I'm glad you liked it well enough, though from what a few are saying I'm guessing that it actually really seems to need work.
Also, hooves are feet, silly.
There's no reason they wouldn't use what is such a generalized term.
Nobody ever believes me when I say that, and some others get defensive, so by definition: a foot is (in vertebrates) the terminal part of the leg, below the ankle joint, on which the body stands and moves. (Sorry to go all dictionary on you
)
I liked it!
7330475
I wrote a ridiculously long response to your comment, in the hope to maybe defend it a little, or at least try and explain my thinking on their world, but that would take too much time and energy to write and read. But I realized that none of that really matters in the end anyway, so I deleted it and wrote this instead. It's too bad this didn't appeal to you more, but I'm not going to change it or start writing it completely different because of that. I do intend to make edits, and perhaps put a little more sadness and remorse into Luna, because I get where you're coming from with this.
But the Luna I wrote for this isn't defined solely by her remorse, it plays an incredibly large part in her behavior, but after her first Nightmare Night it's sat bubbling under the surface rather than worn on her sleeve. To me, that's exactly the same as in show up until the Tantabus event, which these stories take place a number of weeks before. But there are still other things going on in their world that I want Luna to be a part of. I want her to be interactive rather than so completely wound up around her sadness, that it's all she really is as a character. I mean it is certainly there, but she seems to internalize it more than show it.
The reason Celestia is dealing with so much regret in my first story, and is being so hard on herself in general is the exact same reasons that Luna does on her part, I just wanted it to focus a little more on the other side of that coin for once. It's not meant to be bashing her, it's meant to show that she too is full of remorse. That she too was capable of becoming something worse than she ever should have been, and that she hates the very memory. That she too suffers her own form of self-wrought punishment. She's busy feeding her own tantabus of sorts. On my part, with the way it was written, I guess I fail to see how it was bashing her rather than stating their individual (NONcanon) views on her actions.
This is why it stings a little when people think this is a bashfic, or about a tyrantlestia. If I bashed, I'd probably be at least a little meaner about it, almost tauntingly so, and it would be a larger portion of the focus of both stories. And if she was a tyrant, all of Equestria would have been suffering under her rule. But she wasn't, and they didn't. She wasn't ever evil in my story, she was just a spoiled teenager who was in love with the adoration she received. She felt powerful, not so much physically, but emotionally. Like she was on top of the world. She was addicted to that feeling, so much so that she didn't really want to share it, not even with her sister. So like some kids do, she made some cruel mistakes just to stay on top, and they backfired on her one day.
It therefore seems to me that the Luna and Celestia your looking for are in another castle. Remember that this is a fanfiction, one that's not based solely around show canon and it contains personal ideas that include the idea that there is so much more to Luna's personality than just sadness and remorse. And the same stands for Celestia and her usual confidence and joy.
But anyway, there will likely be a third installment to these stories. Maybe you'll end up liking that one better when it's posted if you decide to read it.
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Thank you, I'm glad.
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Now keep in mind this is merely a suggestion. After reading your defense I can definitely see where you were trying to go with this. Like I've been saying at least to me there seems to be very little Luna should be sorry for seeing how all her wrongdoings were done while she was insane. I think this would have worked much better if Luna did not find out until after she returned that it was because of Celestia that the public shunned her especially if she found out without Celestia's knowledge of it. That way it is true that her own very real jealousy is what ultimately led her transformation into NMM even though it was really Celestia's fault that the public shunned her in the first place. Luna knowing that in the past makes it that much harder to make her remorse for her past seem genuine. Similarly Celestia continuing her misdeeds towards Luna even after she was busted just seems entirely too evil, irredeemable, and a very one-sided conflict. Certainly if I was in Luna's shoes it would be nearly impossible for me to ever even think about forgiving Celestia.
A big part of why I love Luna as a character is her redemption and triumph in developing herself into a better ruler. Reading people write her as basically faultless always cheapens her image and just turns her into a very flat Mary Sueish character in my eyes. Giving Luna a bit more fault could do wonders for making the emotions in this seem much more realistic and I do like what you are trying to convey with Celestia being a bit bratty in the past even if I do feel it is going past that into the realm of villainy.
Sorry if my previous comments have seemed a little harsh. I regret not conveying that I do like the basis of the story and the majority of the ideas presented even if Luna's emotions seem artificial and that Celestia seems entirely too evil.
wow u did a great job hope to see more
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So I made some minor changes throughout With Tears in Her Eyes. I'm hoping perhaps it may have made some aspects at least a little bit better? I would like your opinion if you wouldn't mind taking the time.
tia want so tia gonna get and to heck with anything, anyone and any consequences for those tia's want affects
Poor Luna, she's clearly upset about the thing from the prequel... Who wouldn't be though? This was awesome so far, I like how well it portrays emotions. I'm going to go read the next chapter now
You keep amazing me. I wonder where this conversation will end up.
I actually got a bit tear eyed from this story. It was beautiful. I'd like too see things from Luna's perspective. Now, onto the sequel.
Seems to be a word missing. Perhaps it'd read better if you were to add either [she] or [Celestia].
Their eyes? What? What is this statue depicting? You have a paragraph of scenery chewing about bits of it, but not what it actually was or was depicting.
Reread it a few times, and i guess it's of the Element Bearers, but that makes little sense. It's a commemoration of the 1st anniversary of Twilight's Ascension. It should be a statue of Twilight itself. I mean, I GUESS you could argue that the other element bearers had a big part in her ascension, and that this is meant to highlight that fact, but there is zero indication of that in story.
At least for me, I expected a statue of Princess Twilight Sparkle, and the description of it confused and distracted me I was drawn out of the story.
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Well, it was meant to be a gift to Twilight, not a public ego booster.
Besides, she's the Princess of Friendship, in my mind why wouldn't Celestia want her gift to Twilight to contain the elements that shaped her into the pony she has become? I mean, if you don't care for the fact that it included the others, then whatever, I just wanted to portray the image in my head, which just so happened to commemorate all of them seeing as they're pretty much the most important things in her life.
The way I see it, there wasn't actually much time even spent on the statue description part, which may explain why it seems to not contain that little detail of it containing all 6 of them (I should probably fix that). I'm sorry if I seem frustrated, but I guess I'm just finding it hard to believe that of all the flaws in this story -and with no editors or proofreaders, there are MANY- that that's the one you picked out.
Thinking back, I guess I didn't want to spend too much time on the statue because the statue itself isn't the real focus of the story. Either way, it's whatever, I pumped most of these stories out in an evening just to write something, so I can guarantee that there are plenty of details and thoughts that didn't make it to the pages correctly. I'm sorry if the errors threw you off.
8743514
That's fair.
Rainbow Dash is too dull to be cyan. Or at least, in my view she is, going from games I've played Cyan is much brighter. And a touch greener. Or maybe that's teal.
Half the reason I haven't written my own stuff is things like that. I'm not sure if I'm colorblind, or just color stupid. I'm never sure of my word choices, and that's important in writing, or so I hear.
I'm sorry if my comment came across as harsh. I've learned to avoid commenting massive amounts of corrections, and while you had a few it was very readable, save that one part. Which, now that you mention it was less a public celebration and more a gift...I'm at loss for what Luna's beef is, unless it's just more ignoring Luna, in her eyes? Or maybe Luna just misunderstands Celestia's intention.
Ugh, now I feel bad nitpicking it. As an analogy, you described a Great Cat, and I'm asking if it was a tiger, Lion, or panther.
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Don't go fretting over it or anything, it really isn't a big deal. Like I said, most of these were written quickly and are clearly filled with errors, it's good when someone points them out so they can be addressed.
Again, I'm sorry if I came off as frustrated, but this series of stories seem to have new errors I missed every time I look over them lol. It's not the comments frustrating me, but the stories themselves.
I enjoyed this story and it's prequel ... but the last chapter is rather weak.
Why would Cadi be so shocked by the fact that she's going to outlive her husband and friends?
Did she never in all those years since her ascension think about the implications and consequences?
It just doesn't seem like something she'd need to be told.
Sure, she was young when she became an alicorn and may have had other, more fun things, on her mind, but surely she would've realized those things very clearly when she was starting to imagine and later actively plan a future with Shining. She would've realized long ago that being an Alicorn and growing old together with your spouse are mutually exclusive.
Same with purple smart. Twilight IOverAnalzeEverything Sparkle. Twi is emotionally fragile, more so than most other characters. So she's probably shoved it as far to the back of her mind as she could the moment she realized ... but she's certainly aware as well.
Luna is ranting about the one thing that's so obvious that there was no need for Celestia to shove it in their faces.
The real tragedy is how immortality is going to affect their relationships before those ponies pass on.
Friends being reminded of their age and withering bodies every time they look at them, ponies telling them to move on because they don't want to hold them back, aging lovers questioning their feelings, accusing them of sticking around only out of obligation ... etc.
What happens when their partners reach an age where they can no longer 'perform'? That can only mean the alicorns must be cheating on them, right? And what if that's actually not so far from the truth? For an immortal stuck in eternal youth physical needs and love/loyalty towards a spouse will - inevitably in my opinion - become completely separate things.
There's so much potential for tragedy Luna could've hinted at, but nope. In best princess tradition she only states the most obvious.
Welp, it doesn't look like the author is ever going to read this ... but I needed to get this out of my system.