Fluttershy comes out to the rest of the bearers of the Elements as a trans mare. This story follows what happens next: with her, with the mare she's fallen in love with, with the Mane Six, and with respect to their friendship.
This was (and remains, for that matter) my first fic, and was an attempt to apply concepts of transgender identity to Equestria. I felt like a world as accepting of, well, everything as Equestria tends to be would be a fascinating place to explore identity. I hope it worked!
(I wrote this before reading Dash's Secret (by Hopefox), but if you enjoyed this story, I can't recommend Dash's Secret highly enough. It engages with some of the same issues, but is (IMHO) better written than mine. http://www.fimfiction.net/story/1876/Dash%27s-Secret)
A note: "trans mare" refers to somepony assigned male at birth and raised as a colt who comes to identify as a mare later in life. I'm following human usage here.
Acceptable. Certainly the first fanfic I've seen that describes what it's like for us trans people.
Kudos for being brave enough to write this.
Also, liked to counteract pointless insta-unlike.
I have no idea why, but this intrigues me, and I am usually a VERY picky reader.
Have a like.
I'm another transgender person, and I was pleased to see this story on the front page just now. While I'm not a big fan of shipping, nor did I understand why Applejack and Rainbow Dash were apparently together prior to the start of this story, I was at least willing to give it a read through if only because of its subject matter. I think the dialogue was a bit stiff, and the scene where she came out was mostly their reactions; Fluttershy should probably have interacted a lot more there. And while I don't have a problem with homosexuality, I was a bit shocked that three of the five non-transgender ponies were apparently lesbians? That probably goes hand in hand with my dislike for shipping though, so I'll lay off there.
Overall, very courageous. I'm glad to see anyone making a public mention of the issue. Not a fan of the story itself, but thumbs up anyway for its message, and to counteract the thumbs down given by someone who was apparently in too much of a hurry to explain why.
I approve of this, both the story and the fact that you were brave enough to post it. We as a society need more people willing to voice their beliefs, regardless of what the intolerant might think.
I won't unlike this for petty reasons, but I am irked that everyone automatically thinks that Fluttershy would be the trans pony, just like how everyone automatically thinks Rainbow Dash is the gay one. I'm as open-minded as you can get and welcome any and all trans-gender people with open arms, but as a fic this is just obnoxious. You're not the first to do this. For story's sake, why not Twilight? Or Pinkie, even? God, think of what you could write about that.
Yeesh, how cliche. No likes here. But no dislikes, because I'm not petty.
Wait, I'm a little confused as to the description. You say 'assigned male at birth and raised as colt', to me that reads that she is a girl who was raised as a boy, yet the premise of the story seems to be she's a boy who lives and acts as a girl? Somepony please explain this to me, as I am very confused
It's good that Pinkie Pie is so broad minded. I loved the fic.
579426
What stories have done this better, if any? It isn't a cliche to me since it's the first I've heard of it, but as a trans person I'd be interested to read more if you knew of any, which you seem to.
579429
I'm pretty sure the author meant that she was raised male at home, but decided to present herself publicly female. In other words, she's biologically male and was raised male, but is mentally and emotionally female, which is how she shows herself to her friends and basically everyone who knows her. Admittedly, it could have been worded better.
Er... Good try?
Its an interesting concept, but it could have been done better. I really don't like how Rarity, Applejack, and Rainbow Dash kept referring to Fluttershy as a he. I know that they realize the truth at the end, but I really don't like how rude they were about it. The whole point of a sex change is to become the other gender. Referring to a transgender by their old gender is just plain rude. And of course everyone used the stereotype that transgenders were all actually gay. I know you did your best, but it may have been a good idea to write a few fics before this one so you could have had some experience with writing these characters. I'm sorry, but I had to press dislike. I would be interested in rereading this if you rewrote it after you get some more practice in.
579476
I haven't read this one yet, but I will tomorrow. I was skimming the comments, and I thought I'd point out Dash's Secret. I don't know how it compares, but I liked it.
The premise here is quite interesting and, as a person currently undergoing some conflict regarding something of this nature; I would be lying if I said that it didn't touch me in some way.
There are some glaring problems here though, gaping holes that just ruined the experience. Apart from Twilight and Pinkie, the other characters are acting in such a way that I honestly cannot accept. It's been pretty much firmly established that Equestria is so much more open-minded than our own world. Homosexual relationships are accepted, and one would think that the idea of Fluttershy being transgendered wouldn't cause that much of a stir. Would there be some initial shock? Sure, but for her to be so rejected by some of the mane 6 seems... wrong, to put it bluntly. It seems just as wrong to pointlessly thrust in a mane 6 pairing. It also annoys me that you specifically adhered to the stereotypes that the characters have gained from themselves (like Rainbow being the 'gay' one).
The dialogue was also very, very forced apart from a few of the Pinkie lines. I honestly felt like I was sitting through a PSA half-way through this story, and that is not a feeling that you want to elicit from your audience. If you want to write about a pony coming to terms with his or her newly born transgender identity, then I would suggest not even using the mane 6 at all. Use an OC or a background character that has little spotlight in the fandom.
I don't know, the more that I look at this, the more uncomfortable that it makes me feel in my own personal state. I suppose that it's all up to personal preference in the end, but I have to say that it needs serious work.
I'm not going to like or dislike, because I don't know what to make of it. However, I do have a slightly ugly taste in my mouth.
579476
I can't remember any names, sorry, but I remember one on Fanfiction.net and one on... Is it Ponyfiction? They're old as dirt. And I might be confusing fics for fanart. But, it's been done before. I'm wrong to imply that that should stop anyone, though.
I dunno. I can't really see ANY of the Mane 6 as transgender. And I can't see Rainbow Dash as gay, because come on... The athletic rainbow tomboy being a lesbian? Come on, too easy. The shy filly with stunted growth and possible identity issues being trans? Can't see it either.
...Besides, I'm pretty sure it's meant to be friendship between six girls, just from a storytelling standpoint. *shrug*
579517
Thanks, I'll be sure to check it out.
579523
Yeah, I can totally see your point. As I said in my first post, the story has some serious problems and my thumbs up was more to encourage the author's bravery than due to the merits of the writing itself. I always found the Rainbow Dash and occasionally Applejack lesbian thing to be a bit tiresome. Apparently a girl can't be athletic without being gay? So I know where you're coming from with that. Anyway, thanks for responding.
579518
I can totally see where you're coming from with your views there. I think the presentation is largely at fault; the author has good intent, but is lacking the skill to make it sound the way it needs to. The characters responded terribly, nearly the entire cast was out of character for most of the story, and overall there was a major tone of preachiness. What I appreciate here isn't the literal phrasing, but that the issue is getting written about at all. It's a real thing, one which very nearly ruined my own life (I'm still struggling with the disaster it left in its wake), and think any mention of it is better than nothing. You seem like a reasonable enough person, so I'd also like to add that I hope you do okay with your own struggle. I know how nasty it can be.
579545
It's a bizarre double-standard. Like people who humanize the mane 6 and then randomly make Twilight or Rarity black "just to be equal". In of itself, that's actually more racist than just admitting that they're all pretty damn white.
Trans and gay people can be anyone. People in this fandom consecutively project the trans community onto RD or Flutters, and that to me isn't really fair. If that's how you see yourself then ok, but... I dunno. It'd be better to use an OC imo.
579576
Agreed entirely. Though I always figured Twilight is popular with darker skin more because it suits her color scheme, it's pretty obvious from the way the characters talk and act that none of them are anything but white. You can call that racist if you want, but I personally think it's more racist to go around "correcting" things because you can't let it go, than it is to just do what seems to be logically correct. As for your comment about trans/gay people, it's irritating beyond all reason that people think we have certain obvious giveaways. I think this story doesn't work with the Mane 6, largely because their characters are already well-established and at this point it feels like it would have to be shoehorned in; OCs or background ponies would have been fine, though.
579545
Mm, that is true. However, I don't think that MLP is the best media outlet to bring it up. If it is, then it does need to be done more tastefully. I agree full-heartedly with That one guy in saying that this would have flowed so much more smoothly with an OC. That way the author wouldn't be accused of exploiting stereotypes.
I mean, the intent for good is there. I like that, I really do, and I respect the fact the author had the courage to post something confronting the issue. Yet at the same time, the end result turned out much like one of those occasional stories that try to thrust ponies into real life historical events. It turns offensive as a result, even if the opposite was intended.
I hope that things turn out okay with your life
And I thank you. While my conflict isn't the same as the issue that this story is confronting, I agree. It's difficult. It's Hell. And it makes me wish that our world was just as accepting as the technicolor paradise on the other sides of our computer screens.
579634
Yeah, I understand what you mean. It was a good-hearted attempt, but it was executed with such a lack of grace that it really just made itself and the message it was trying to deliver look bad as a result. I still say that bad publicity is better than no publicity, though. The first step is getting people to know it's even a real thing, and after that we can worry about things like their opinion on the issue (which is often going to be negative regardless of how they heard about it).
I don't think that this issue is some nightmarish thing that should never be touched by MLP. Just like I don't think Earth should be a total taboo. It's just that it requires a certain level of skill to make it work, and anything less than that is going to come across as shallow or juvenile. I think there are easier universes to wedge this topic into, but by no means do I think it couldn't work at all. One of the biggest issues I've noticed in fanfiction though is that far too many writers are all but too happy to break everyone's character if it'll help get their story to work. That's bad. It should be avoided at all costs, and the vast majority of stories are rendered unreadable to me as a result.
If it were delivered more believably, and with better subtlety, and without touching upon so many overdone tropes within this fanon, it could have been better. Instead of a good story about a character coming to terms with herself, we got the mane six breaking character and speaking robotically all in an effort to present a message as anviliciously as possible. It's not the fault of the message though, that's my point. It's just that the writer needs more experience.
And if you read this, AnneCD, don't be discouraged. You only get better by writing more. If you want this message to make it to as many people as it can, then practice and keep writing stories! Maybe avoid this subject for a little while. A few years down the road, when you have more control over your craft, maybe give it another shot and see if people respond better! I bet they will if you've been practicing!
Edit: Oh, and thank you for your well wishes. I wish you the same! Whatever you're going through, I know it's rough, but you seem level-headed enough. I think you'll be fine if you keep your wits about you!
Well, the fic didn't suck, but it didn't deserve a dislike either.
We need a sideways thumb on this site.
Aww so heart warming, but Twilight is going to get the dick hahaha
Brave, but not exactly the best choice to do a first fanfic that is widely shared (making it just for oneself or one or two others can be very good practice and get the ideas flowing for doing a better version later on). Still, better than the first fanfic I wrote which was outright bad (luckily, I passed it by someone who told me so before I made the mistake of posting it somewhere), so you will get further than me in writing, especially if you keep at it.
The rest of the mane 6's reactions fit more like "decent reactions" (by "decent", I mean better than horrible but not great) of humans to this sort of news rather than how the mane 6 would likely react (which would be quite a bit better I think, though probably equally ill-informed). Still though, if people understood that in our human world, these types of reactions are sadly the best we can hope for but rarely get and how unfair even the better end of reactions is. I hope that people reading this will see that, though it will probably take some thinking, but maybe this will get them started down the path. So, I would say continue working on fanfics and refining your abilities and then take another whack at a trans* related fanfic in this fandom or another.
About projecting trans* identities onto the mane 6, I take a sort of probabilistic view of it. There is no real reason why any of them (or any of the MLP characters) couldn't be trans* (I mean, none of them have said they are cis gender yet), so any of them could be with equal probability. You know what would be really interesting, if someone wrote a fanfic where one of them came out as a trans stallion or trans ____ where _____ is a non-binary identity. I personally project trans* identities on them a lot more than would probabilistically make sense. This is probably because I was introduced to MLP by a trans* community that I am a member of (I'm trans*, no surprise) and we have a few people who share quite a few similarities with some of the mane 6 (Twilight, Fluttershy, Rarity, and Rainbow Dash).
Somehow I missed this due to not refreshing but it deserves comment.
580052
Not necessarily on the second part of your statement and it isn't really any more or less humorous any other particular genitalia. If they are anything like people in this regard, ponies could be quite creative with sex and like people, some would be comfortable using their original genitals and some would not.
Interesting. To those who complained about how it was rude how Rainbow, Applejack, and Rarity kept referring to Fluttershy as a "he," well, that's the point. That's what happens in real life. It's illogical, stupid, and insulting, and it happens. And it sucks.
While the structure wasn't the best, I applaud your effort. I haven't seen this idea done in a MLP fic before, and the story is certainly more than competent. Maybe with a bit of work to make the dialogue more natural, and a little bit better pacing, this could be a very good story. I felt that the second meeting of the group where everyone was fully accepting happened too quickly, and didn't allow enough time to where the news could have plausibly sunk in. That and the characters changed their views a bit too quickly. I think that somepony who is going to immediately start calling Fluttershy a he upon learning that she was born male would take a bit more convincing than was shown in the story. I would have appreciated a more accurate portrayal of how annoyingly difficult it can be to get people to use the correct pronouns.
Anyhow, thumbs up from yet-another Flutterguy-turned-Fluttershy.
well written and good story
580267True true, but they could get curious about their new one and see how it feels to them.
580344
I agree entirely.
Now, onto my own opinion of the story, I like it. I am not a transgender person, I am female, but I like the message of accepting them for who they are woven into this fic. I do agree the dialogue was a bit off, and a few punctuation/grammatical errors here and there, but with a few sessions of editing and revising it could be fixed.
Alas, I do think the rest of the Mane 6 overreacted a bit much to Rarity's comment, or, question, rather. It was something perfectly natural to ask, as she said, and I guess that does happen in real life. I dunno, just something to ponder of.
Despite all that, I liked the story (and the moral, like I said), so I guess all I can say is good job.
(Btw, That_One_Guy was being extremely petty and touchy in his comment. Don't feel bad.
)
~T3cHn0 K!tT3n
@AnneCD:
After all the debate last night, I'm going to post a final opinion here. This story was not as bad as some of the arguing may have led you to believe. It was a good attempt at something you're just not quite up to the challenge of writing about yet. I commend you for the effort though, and I'm always grateful to see someone who is aware and sympathetic of these issues. The worst thing you can do for yourself at this point would be to give up, so please keep writing! There were elements of this story that made no sense to me, but the overall message is something I can get behind. On the whole I'm glad you wrote this, and that's why my upvote stays.
Keep being awesome.
580344
Oh jeez, the pronouns thing. I have no idea why that matters to me so much, but it does. Sometimes I'm not even sure what to call myself! It often just depends on the context, though I almost universally prefer the feminine. Anyway, I just wanted to say I agree with pretty much your whole post. And your avatar makes me sad, she looks so troubled! Cheer up, nameless orange pony!
I wasn't expecting to have one of my stories mentioned in somepony else's Author's Note, so thank you!
I like this story. I think you've done a good job of presenting the issue and making the points you want to make. You've said that it's your first fanfiction, and it does show, but you've done well, and I am sure your writing will improve with practice.
The main flaw I would point out is that the story is quite short, but tries to accomplish a lot. As such, parts of it seem a bit rushed, especially Fluttershy's initial admission to her friends. I think that could have done with more build-up. Likewise her romance with Twilight - it seemed to come out of nowhere. A page of two to round out these facets of Fluttershy's life would have made the whole thing a fair bit smoother. Your dialogue is also a bit rough, which is, I think, why some people have a problem with the others' reactions. Dialogue is hard, though, so just keep trying.
I don't have any problem with Fluttershy's friends' reactions. Some of them were very unfortunate, but that's the nature of such revelations. The show isn't about friends being 100% awesome to each other all the time - sometimes it's about friends being jerks to each other, hurting each others' feelings, realising that they've been jerks, apologising and making everything better. That's exactly what's happened here, and that's good. I really did like Pinkie Pie's reaction, though. It really rang true for her - not having a problem with it, and not understanding why anypony else would have a problem with it.
The part I didn't understand, though, is exactly what Fluttershy's situation is. Has she transitioned physically? If so, how (magic? surgery?) and when? If not, what are the steps she takes in order to pass? (I didn't explain this very well in my story either, admittedly.)
I definitely commend you for writing and publishing this story in the first place. There isn't a great deal of fanfiction (or published fiction, for that matter) about transgender issues, and plenty of sites treat it as a "kink" rather than a social issue, which I think is pretty awful. Don't worry about criticism that Fluttershy is the "obvious trans character" - I've been told the same thing about Rainbow Dash. And I've read (a summary of) a story about Rarity being trans, played entirely for laughs, which is possibly the least cool thing ever. So yeah, feel good about this, and keep writing!
582720
Nameless orange pony? I guess those stories that have the Wonderbolts not being recognized when out of uniform really are on to something! It's Spitfire silly, I think from the comic version of this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JWa0kkIRumk
I was feeling troubled at the time. I think it's time that I change the image to match my Facebook image, because curly-haired happy Twilight is best pony.
@NoMoreSanity
You do realize that using characters that were already established in the show to avoid having to create your own character is kind of one of the central tenants of a fanfic, right? Using a character that is already established and putting them in a new situation?
585132
Heh, okay, well I feel a bit dumb now. Then again, I don't think I've seen her out of uniform in canon that I can recall, and I've only been a member of this fandom for a few short months. I love your new image though!
I'd like to give you props for approaching this issue in the first place. I do honestly feel that a show like this would be the perfect platform to educate children on very sensitive social topics like this. What better way to get a positive message across? For this, I give you kudos for even touching the subject to begin with.
However.
Your execution is greatly flawed. The story is too short to do a sensitive social issue justice. Everything is resolved far too quickly. Not only that, but there is no build-up to anything. I sort of did a double take when Twilight admitted her feelings for Fluttershy, and the admittance that Dash and Applejack were together. There was nothing to indicate this would happen; there was no setting the scene. It just sort of... appeared.
Perhaps in the beginning, when Fluttershy was mustering her courage, she could have thought back to when Applejack and Rainbow first revealed they were together. That she could admit her feelings towards Twilight thanks to their brave example. This would have served as a way to reveal what was going on instead of having info come out from left field. You could have also brought up Fluttershy's brief experience with the poison joke and her manly voice, and how she was worried that would out her, or something. Lots of potential missed.
In the technical side of things, the pacing is off, you don't know how to punctuate dialogue, and it has the feel of simplicity to a very complex social issue. A good once over of editing would have made for a better reading experience. I get this feeling that this story is a long synopsis for something much larger, but it never got off the ground. This is a bit disappointing that is isn't.
Practice your writing some more, and know fully of what you are getting yourself into next time. I hope this helps in some way.
Keep writing, and have a good one.
Before I write anything, first off.. **** load of comments
. Also, I really like this in an intriguing sort of way, one for having the balls to post this because frankly and including me I would have never had the balls to even if I put the entirety of my effort into writing this, and two, I do agree with that one guy and pray that you were open minded about writing this, not just compelled to be a comedian and write it because of some futashy meme. Anyways though, I did like the writing and am in working on my own first FiMFiC. Anyways.. here's and upvote! Keep up the good work! And god bless!
,
Interesting concept! I feel like it fell a bit weak in several spots though.
The main thing that bothered me was Fluttershy's lead up to telling everypony she was transgender. It seems out of character, as Fluttershy doesn't like it when all eyes are on her. It would make more sense if she were to talk to one of her friends in private, and then the situation blew up from there.
There also was no reason listed as to why Fluttershy would even want to disclose this information at all, she kind of just... does it. Maybe it would be a bit more consistant if there was a brief scene in the beginning showing Fluttershy feeling guilty, or showing that she felt like this was something she needed to tell her friends? Or maybe there was a threat of her being outed, so she wanted to tell her friends before they found out? I feel like it's just out of character for Fluttershy to just to tell her friends this with no build-up.
I feel like Rarity, Rainbow, and Applejack were really out of character too. None of them would be that rude toward her, especially applejack and Rainbow who destroy the gender norms as it is since she's they're both not very feminine. They all switch to "he" suddenly with no second thought. They don't even question that concept either; they just believe it and adhere to it instantly without asking any farther questions and then rudely switch to calling her "he" abruptly.
As someone who's active in the transgender community, I really like this idea though! It was a nice attempt and I hope to see more
This was an interesting read. I remember months ago that there was a story that had Fluttershy being trans, but for the life of me I can't place it since I never read it. So I can't say anything about this being 'done to death'. Of course, if a few stories following a similar vein qualifies, then pretty much all stories are guilty.
Anyway, back on task. What made this story a real joy was Pinkie. She was beyond awesome in her defense of Fluttershy. Her refusing to see her different was great to see, and the TwiShy was just the icing on the cake.
Had to re-read this. Must mean that this story really meant something to me (this is a good thing).
761893
If you ever find that story, could you let me know.
If I'm honest, I'm not the biggest fan of the relation-shipping thing; however, this story did a pairing so bloody well that there was no reason not to love it. These stories are a rare breed, indeed, and I thank you for writing one of the lot. Now, mechanically, some things could have been done better; that, however, is picking nits compared to the great things about the story. As a final note, I say this: Bravo, Madame! Bravo!
This is a good story! Don't stop writing! Have an upvote.
579495
Actually, this was the part of the story that was done right.
Yes, how they reacted was not understanding or politically correct, but why should it be? They're characters. They make mistakes. They create conflict. And then they learn. Having the characters instantly figure out how they should be treating Fluttershy would be simply unrealistic.
And that's why I actually had a problem with Pinkie Pie in this story. She gets it too quickly, and then she essentially becomes a vehicle for the author's message. It's clear from the start that Pinkie Pie is pushing the author's views on the subject, and it ends up making the message very heavy-handed. And just because I agree with the message the author is trying to make doesn't mean it can't be implemented better and emerge naturally from the story instead of being delivered by one of the characters.
584106
I think I'm in love with you. I wish I had commenters like you.
I liked the fic, it made me smile wich is all I really ask.
It had a few problems though, mainly being a tad short and everything resolving a bit too quickly and easily.
All in all, Pinkie was the show stealer.
1278896
The way I saw it, considering how many friends Pinkie got (All of Ponyville and counting), it's not very unlikely that she already knew another transpony and learned from that. Or maybe she's just like some (very rare) people who just don't care about stuff like that. Fluttershy is her friend and she wants her to be happy and thats good enough for Pinkie.
Heck I ramble, your criticism is valid, I just don't agree with it fully.
<<yourpalrainbowdash>> lol i agree with appledash XD
Poor Fluttershy...
But happy ending =D
I won't pick this story apart, as others have already done a very thorough job of it. I just want to add my two cents quickly.
This story would be much stronger if you just stuck with the transgender conflict rather than miring it in shipping. Both the conflicts and the resolutions are thrown at us without any sense of buildup. Pick your conflict. Stick with it. Actually explore everything you can about it. By doing that, you'll end up with a much stronger story.
I have to agree with what the others said. The premise is good and the topic is one to be addressed, but the overall flow and characterization require a certain finesse that was absent without some touching up and polish.
Likewise, you deserve kudos for actually being able to address the issue like this
At first, I'm like:
This'll rock!
Then I'm like:
What? I already read this!
How'd that happen...?
As a transwoman I can say that this was a nice story that could be used as a template for a much longer story that covers trans issues. I enjoyed the story I really did but it felt like the rough draft of an episode from the show. I think you are brave for approching the topic and makeing pinkie pie's charecter have the mindset everyone should have when it relates to trans was nice to see.
If you ever decide to give this story an edit or even rewrite it I will gladly check it out
So... I didn't like this very much, mostly for reasons 584106 brought up in his post. To sum up my problems in my own (shorter) way:
- wouldn't anyone notice? (ponies do walk around naked...)
- aren't there ways to simply change your gender? Did Fluttershy ask Celestia? I mean, if it doesn't work that's fine, but it should at least be brought up
- the ending is incredibly contrived
- the main 6 are... I don't like using the term OOC, because characterization isn't objective, but it's incomprehensible with how I interpret them. there's no way they'd be this rude. Reminds me of Bridle Gossip.
- you say absolutely nothing interesting about the issue of gender identity.
One point where I disagree with NMS is that I think MLP would be a great place to explore gender related issues; you'll have an easier time reaching a believable happy ending because your story takes place in a more tolerant society. But I don't think this is well executed.
"Clap Clap Clap"
This was beautiful